Housing starts and "natural population growth" (aka land depletion) - Page 12

> > > > > A number of articles on the economic situation claim that "natural
> > > > > population growth" justifies and/or will absorb surplus housing
> starts
> > > > > in the current market. In general, housing starts, i.e. new homes
> > > > > untouched land, are mostly about population growth, with the
> > > > > expectation that it will never end.
> > > > > But, there is nothing "natural" about annual world population

> > > > > of 75,000,000, with U.S. population growth at 3,000,000 per year.
> > > > > any other large animal grew its numbers like Man, we'd call it a
> > > > > plague and send in the troops.
> > > > > Endless growth of any kind (except intelligence) on a FINITE

> is
> > > > > UNnatural and should never be encouraged just to create

> > > > > jobs.
> > > > > E.A.
> > > > >http://enough_already.tripod.com/
> > > > > Can one really be a productive member of a consumptive society?
> > > > Over population is a terrible problem!! It is the very basis for all
> > > > our environmental problems and is even affecting human behavior and
> > > > health. It heads the human race towards doom,. But what is so

> > > > is that no writer can make money writing about it. It is not in the
> > > > newspapers or magazines, not on TV. It is a taboo subject, anethama.
> > > > It offends the Catholics and the Creationists, Muslim terrorists and
> > > > anti-abortionists. It seems that no one wants to offend them and

> > > > up controversy.
> > > > In "Destiny and Civilization," I describe how this biological

> > > > develops. Different animals go through different processes when they
> > > > grow too numerous in a limited area. Our problem is that like some
> > > > them, behavior has been showing signs of deteriorating. Stress and
> > > > hostility build up. We have the West, Islam, Marxist China and India
> > > > all competing for the remaining resources. The struggle from them

> > > > only get more brutal.
> > > > What will happen is that either there is a population crash up

> > > > probably within the next forty years,or we adopt a new ideological
> > > > system, one which has among its clearly stated goals, to limit
> > > > population increase, promote recycling and eliminating waste.
> > > > charleshttp://atheistic-science.com
> > > Every system is self limiting. Let me repeat, every system is self
> > > limiting. So why would one believe that population is different. It
> > > will self limit. It might take a while and there might be problems
> > > here and there until equilibrium is found, but in the end it will

> > > limit.
> > > As for now, there is plenty of room left in the world and more than
> > > enough space to grow food. Where I live, lots more land it taken OUT
> > > of production than put into production, but we still seem to grow more
> > > and more food year in and year out.
> > > Energy use will remain in equilibrium forever. It has to. There is
> > > no choice. If oil goes higher, then more substitutes will come onto
> > > the market. There is nothing magical about oil -- it is just the
> > > thing that replaced whale-oil when that became too expensive. Whale
> > > oil replaced something else. Something will eventually replace
> > > petroleum. If you think about it, we will NEVER run out of oil.
> > > Never. Never. Someday it will get too expensive to extract the last
> > > little bit and the substitutes will take over and the remaining oil
> > > will stay in the ground just like the remaining whales stayed in the
> > > ocean.
> > > What will replace oil? Who knows. We aren't to the point of finding
> > > out, yet. There's still plenty of it.
> > Soylent Green?
> > > If you people want something to worry about, worry about the Sun. It
> > > will eventually burn out and then we will all be in trouble. That's
> > > about the only certainty.- Hide quoted text -
> > > - Show quoted text -
> No, it's just that most people in the thread think that the world is a
> stagnant place and right now is the best possible situation but that
> everything will get worse from here. Guess what. The only constant
> is that things will change. Change is inevitable. 50 years ago no
> one ever how we would get here. But guess what, it happened. Maybe
> the biggest difference between and most other people here is that I
> have the people are resourceful, I believe that change can be for the
> better, and I am very optimistic about the human race. Things are
> good.
> ---
> Fine, but do you apply that to cities? As in "city growth of the past
> 50-100 years is good?"

> > > > A number of articles on the economic situation claim that "natural
> > > > population growth" justifies and/or will absorb surplus housing sta=

> > > > in the current market. In general, housing starts, i.e. new homes o=
> > > > untouched land, are mostly about population growth, with the
> > > > expectation that it will never end.
> > > > But, there is nothing "natural" about annual world population growt=
> > > > of 75,000,000, with U.S. population growth at 3,000,000 per year. I=
> > > > any other large animal grew its numbers like Man, we'd call it a
> > > > plague and send in the troops.
> > > > Endless growth of any kind (except intelligence) on a FINITE planet=

> > > > UNnatural and should never be encouraged just to create constructio=
> > > > jobs.
> > > > E.A.
> > > >http://enough_already.tripod.com/
> > > > Can one really be a productive member of a consumptive society?
> > > Over population is a terrible problem!! =A0It is the very basis for a=
> > > our environmental problems and is even affecting human behavior and
> > > health. =A0It heads the human race towards doom,. But what is so amaz=

> > > is that no writer can make money writing about it. =A0It is not in th=
> > > newspapers or magazines, not on TV. =A0It is a taboo subject, anetham=
> > > It offends the Catholics and the Creationists, Muslim terrorists and
> > > anti-abortionists. =A0It seems that no one wants to offend them and s=

> > > up controversy.
> > > In "Destiny and Civilization," I describe how this biological process
> > > develops. =A0Different animals go through different processes when th=
> > > grow too numerous in a limited area. Our problem is that like some of
> > > them, behavior has been showing signs of deteriorating. =A0Stress and
> > > hostility build up. =A0We have the West, Islam, Marxist China and Ind=
> > > all competing for the remaining resources. =A0The struggle from them =

> > > only get more brutal.
> > > What will happen is that either there is a population crash up ahead,
> > > probably within the next forty years,or we adopt a new ideological
> > > system, one which has among its clearly stated goals, to limit
> > > population increase, promote recycling and eliminating waste.
> > > charleshttp://atheistic-science.com
> > Every system is self limiting. =A0Let me repeat, every system is self
> > limiting. =A0So why would one believe that population is different. =A0=
> > will self limit. =A0It might take a while and there might be problems
> > here and there until equilibrium is found, but in the end it will self-
> > limit.
> > As for now, there is plenty of room left in the world and more than
> > enough space to grow food. =A0Where I live, lots more land it taken OUT
> > of production than put into production, but we still seem to grow more
> > and more food year in and year out.
> > Energy use will remain in equilibrium forever. =A0It has to. =A0There i=
> > no choice. =A0If oil goes higher, then more substitutes will come onto
> > the market. =A0There is nothing magical about oil -- it is just the
> > thing that replaced whale-oil when that became too expensive. =A0Whale
> > oil replaced something else. =A0Something will eventually replace
> > petroleum. =A0If you think about it, we will NEVER run out of oil.
> > Never. =A0Never. =A0Someday it will get too expensive to extract the la=
> > little bit and the substitutes will take over and the remaining oil
> > will stay in the ground just like the remaining whales stayed in the
> > ocean.
> > What will replace oil? =A0Who knows. =A0We aren't to the point of findi=
> > out, yet. =A0There's still plenty of it.
> Soylent Green?

> > > > > A number of articles on the economic situation claim that "natura=
> > > > > population growth" justifies and/or will absorb surplus housing s=

> > > > > in the current market. In general, housing starts, i.e. new homes=

> > > > > untouched land, are mostly about population growth, with the
> > > > > expectation that it will never end.
> > > > > But, there is nothing "natural" about annual world population gro=

> > > > > of 75,000,000, with U.S. population growth at 3,000,000 per year.=

> > > > > any other large animal grew its numbers like Man, we'd call it a
> > > > > plague and send in the troops.
> > > > > Endless growth of any kind (except intelligence) on a FINITE plan=

> > > > > UNnatural and should never be encouraged just to create construct=

> > > > > jobs.
> > > > > E.A.
> > > > >http://enough_already.tripod.com/
> > > > > Can one really be a productive member of a consumptive society?
> > > > Over population is a terrible problem!! =A0It is the very basis for=

> > > > our environmental problems and is even affecting human behavior and
> > > > health. =A0It heads the human race towards doom,. But what is so am=

> > > > is that no writer can make money writing about it. =A0It is not in =

> > > > newspapers or magazines, not on TV. =A0It is a taboo subject, aneth=

> > > > It offends the Catholics and the Creationists, Muslim terrorists an=
> > > > anti-abortionists. =A0It seems that no one wants to offend them and=

> > > > up controversy.
> > > > In "Destiny and Civilization," I describe how this biological proce=
> > > > develops. =A0Different animals go through different processes when =

> > > > grow too numerous in a limited area. Our problem is that like some =
> > > > them, behavior has been showing signs of deteriorating. =A0Stress a=
> > > > hostility build up. =A0We have the West, Islam, Marxist China and I=

> > > > all competing for the remaining resources. =A0The struggle from the=

> > > > only get more brutal.
> > > > What will happen is that either there is a population crash up ahea=
> > > > probably within the next forty years,or we adopt a new ideological
> > > > system, one which has among its clearly stated goals, to limit
> > > > population increase, promote recycling and eliminating waste.
> > > > charleshttp://atheistic-science.com
> > > Every system is self limiting. =A0Let me repeat, every system is self
> > > limiting. =A0So why would one believe that population is different. =

> > > will self limit. =A0It might take a while and there might be problems
> > > here and there until equilibrium is found, but in the end it will sel=
> > > limit.
> > > As for now, there is plenty of room left in the world and more than
> > > enough space to grow food. =A0Where I live, lots more land it taken O=
> > > of production than put into production, but we still seem to grow mor=
> > > and more food year in and year out.
> > > Energy use will remain in equilibrium forever. =A0It has to. =A0There=

> > > no choice. =A0If oil goes higher, then more substitutes will come ont=
> > > the market. =A0There is nothing magical about oil -- it is just the
> > > thing that replaced whale-oil when that became too expensive. =A0Whal=
> > > oil replaced something else. =A0Something will eventually replace
> > > petroleum. =A0If you think about it, we will NEVER run out of oil.
> > > Never. =A0Never. =A0Someday it will get too expensive to extract the =

> > > little bit and the substitutes will take over and the remaining oil
> > > will stay in the ground just like the remaining whales stayed in the
> > > ocean.
> > > What will replace oil? =A0Who knows. =A0We aren't to the point of fin=

> > > out, yet. =A0There's still plenty of it.
> > Soylent Green?
> > > If you people want something to worry about, worry about the Sun. =A0=
> > > will eventually burn out and then we will all be in trouble. =A0That'=
> > > about the only certainty.- Hide quoted text -
> > > - Show quoted text -
> No, it's just that most people in the thread think that the world is a
> stagnant place and right now is the best possible situation but that
> everything will get worse from here. =A0Guess what. =A0The only constant
> is that things will change. =A0Change is inevitable. =A050 years ago no
> one ever how we would get here. =A0But guess what, it happened. =A0Maybe
> the biggest difference between and most other people here is that I
> have the people are resourceful, I believe that change can be for the
> better, and I am very optimistic about the human race. =A0Things are
> good.

>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> A number of articles on the economic situation claim that
>>>>>> "natural population growth" justifies and/or will absorb surplus
>>>>>> housing starts in the current market. In general, housing
>>>>>> starts, i.e. new homes on untouched land, are mostly about
>>>>>> population growth, with the expectation that it will never end.
>>>>>> But, there is nothing "natural" about annual world population
>>>>>> growth of 75,000,000, with U.S. population growth at 3,000,000
>>>>>> per year. If any other large animal grew its numbers like Man,
>>>>>> we'd call it a plague and send in the troops.
>>>>>> Endless growth of any kind (except intelligence) on a FINITE
>>>>>> planet is UNnatural and should never be encouraged just to
>>>>>> create construction jobs.
>>>>>> E.A.
>>>>>> http://enough_already.tripod.com/
>>>>>> Can one really be a productive member of a consumptive society?
>>>>> Over population is a terrible problem!! It is the very basis for
>>>>> all our environmental problems and is even affecting human
>>>>> behavior and health. It heads the human race towards doom,. But
>>>>> what is so amazing is that no writer can make money writing about
>>>>> it. It is not in the newspapers or magazines, not on TV. It is a
>>>>> taboo subject, anethama. It offends the Catholics and the
>>>>> Creationists, Muslim terrorists and anti-abortionists. It seems
>>>>> that no one wants to offend them and stir up controversy.
>>>>> In "Destiny and Civilization," I describe how this biological
>>>>> process develops. Different animals go through different
>>>>> processes when they grow too numerous in a limited area. Our
>>>>> problem is that like some of them, behavior has been showing
>>>>> signs of deteriorating. Stress and hostility build up. We have
>>>>> the West, Islam, Marxist China and India all competing for the
>>>>> remaining resources. The struggle from them can only get more
>>>>> brutal.
>>>>> What will happen is that either there is a population crash up
>>>>> ahead, probably within the next forty years,or we adopt a new
>>>>> ideological system, one which has among its clearly stated goals,
>>>>> to limit population increase, promote recycling and eliminating
>>>>> waste.
>>>>> charleshttp://atheistic-science.com
>>>> Every system is self limiting. Let me repeat, every system is self
>>>> limiting. So why would one believe that population is different. It
>>>> will self limit. It might take a while and there might be problems
>>>> here and there until equilibrium is found, but in the end it will
>>>> self- limit.
>>>> As for now, there is plenty of room left in the world and more than
>>>> enough space to grow food. Where I live, lots more land it taken
>>>> OUT of production than put into production, but we still seem to
>>>> grow more and more food year in and year out.
>>>> Energy use will remain in equilibrium forever. It has to. There is
>>>> no choice. If oil goes higher, then more substitutes will come onto
>>>> the market. There is nothing magical about oil -- it is just the
>>>> thing that replaced whale-oil when that became too expensive. Whale
>>>> oil replaced something else. Something will eventually replace
>>>> petroleum. If you think about it, we will NEVER run out of oil.
>>>> Never. Never. Someday it will get too expensive to extract the last
>>>> little bit and the substitutes will take over and the remaining oil
>>>> will stay in the ground just like the remaining whales stayed in
>>>> the ocean.
>>>> What will replace oil? Who knows. We aren't to the point of finding
>>>> out, yet. There's still plenty of it.
>>> Soylent Green?
>>>> If you people want something to worry about, worry about the Sun.
>>>> It will eventually burn out and then we will all be in trouble.
>>>> That's about the only certainty.- Hide quoted text -
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>> No, it's just that most people in the thread think that the world is
>> a stagnant place and right now is the best possible situation but
>> that everything will get worse from here. Guess what. The only
>> constant
>> is that things will change. Change is inevitable. 50 years ago no
>> one ever how we would get here. But guess what, it happened. Maybe
>> the biggest difference between and most other people here is that I
>> have the people are resourceful, I believe that change can be for the
>> better, and I am very optimistic about the human race. Things are
>> good.
> I am watching at this moment at the population of Easter island
> growing an growing in an island of a about 15 miles. They started by
> killing all the land birds of the island that were flightless. Later
> they exterminated all the marine birds that were nesting on the
> island. They started to chop down trees to make room for
> agriculture. Then when the excess population was becoming impossible,
> they began to quarrel and to kill each other. Then, to avoid civil
> wars, they started the industry of building statues bigger and bigger
> each year. This way, they got the young population busy carving the
> statues, and carrying them to coast. With this entertainment the
> retarded the time of reproducing of the young people. The trouble with
> the statues is they needed to cut trees to make rails and paths to
> carry the statues to the shore. They had also to chop down some trees
> to make ropes with the fibers of their bark. Then after a century and
> a half, the stopped carving statues. There were no more tree to chop
> on the island. the, during the night, people from a clan pulled down
> the statues of the rival clans. And little by little they were
> tumbling down all the statues and ended in a terrible and constant
> warfare, that nearly annihilated most of the population.
> This proves that human mind are not rational on collective issues.
> And that something as visible as very tall trees can be tumbled down
> with a stone chopper till there is not any more left on the island.

> This proves, that population does not stop ion
> their own, but by the way of little catastrophes.

> I am very pessimistic about the collective mind of humans is rational.

>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> A number of articles on the economic situation claim that
>>>>>> "natural population growth" justifies and/or will absorb surplus
>>>>>> housing starts in the current market. In general, housing
>>>>>> starts, i.e. new homes on untouched land, are mostly about
>>>>>> population growth, with the expectation that it will never end.
>>>>>> But, there is nothing "natural" about annual world population
>>>>>> growth of 75,000,000, with U.S. population growth at 3,000,000
>>>>>> per year. If any other large animal grew its numbers like Man,
>>>>>> we'd call it a plague and send in the troops.
>>>>>> Endless growth of any kind (except intelligence) on a FINITE
>>>>>> planet is UNnatural and should never be encouraged just to
>>>>>> create construction jobs.
>>>>>> E.A.
>>>>>> http://enough_already.tripod.com/
>>>>>> Can one really be a productive member of a consumptive society?
>>>>> Over population is a terrible problem!! It is the very basis for
>>>>> all our environmental problems and is even affecting human
>>>>> behavior and health. It heads the human race towards doom,. But
>>>>> what is so amazing is that no writer can make money writing about
>>>>> it. It is not in the newspapers or magazines, not on TV. It is a
>>>>> taboo subject, anethama. It offends the Catholics and the
>>>>> Creationists, Muslim terrorists and anti-abortionists. It seems
>>>>> that no one wants to offend them and stir up controversy.
>>>>> In "Destiny and Civilization," I describe how this biological
>>>>> process develops. Different animals go through different
>>>>> processes when they grow too numerous in a limited area. Our
>>>>> problem is that like some of them, behavior has been showing
>>>>> signs of deteriorating. Stress and hostility build up. We have
>>>>> the West, Islam, Marxist China and India all competing for the
>>>>> remaining resources. The struggle from them can only get more
>>>>> brutal.
>>>>> What will happen is that either there is a population crash up
>>>>> ahead, probably within the next forty years,or we adopt a new
>>>>> ideological system, one which has among its clearly stated goals,
>>>>> to limit population increase, promote recycling and eliminating
>>>>> waste.
>>>>> charleshttp://atheistic-science.com
>>>> Every system is self limiting. Let me repeat, every system is self
>>>> limiting. So why would one believe that population is different. It
>>>> will self limit. It might take a while and there might be problems
>>>> here and there until equilibrium is found, but in the end it will
>>>> self- limit.
>>>> As for now, there is plenty of room left in the world and more than
>>>> enough space to grow food. Where I live, lots more land it taken
>>>> OUT of production than put into production, but we still seem to
>>>> grow more and more food year in and year out.
>>>> Energy use will remain in equilibrium forever. It has to. There is
>>>> no choice. If oil goes higher, then more substitutes will come onto
>>>> the market. There is nothing magical about oil -- it is just the
>>>> thing that replaced whale-oil when that became too expensive. Whale
>>>> oil replaced something else. Something will eventually replace
>>>> petroleum. If you think about it, we will NEVER run out of oil.
>>>> Never. Never. Someday it will get too expensive to extract the last
>>>> little bit and the substitutes will take over and the remaining oil
>>>> will stay in the ground just like the remaining whales stayed in
>>>> the ocean.
>>>> What will replace oil? Who knows. We aren't to the point of finding
>>>> out, yet. There's still plenty of it.
>>> Soylent Green?
>>>> If you people want something to worry about, worry about the Sun.
>>>> It will eventually burn out and then we will all be in trouble.
>>>> That's about the only certainty.- Hide quoted text -
>>>> - Show quoted text -
>> No, it's just that most people in the thread think that the world is
>> a stagnant place and right now is the best possible situation but
>> that everything will get worse from here. Guess what. The only
>> constant
>> is that things will change. Change is inevitable. 50 years ago no
>> one ever how we would get here. But guess what, it happened. Maybe
>> the biggest difference between and most other people here is that I
>> have the people are resourceful, I believe that change can be for the
>> better, and I am very optimistic about the human race. Things are
>> good.
> I am watching at this moment at the population of Easter island
> growing an growing in an island of a about 15 miles. They started by
> killing all the land birds of the island that were flightless. Later
> they exterminated all the marine birds that were nesting on the
> island. They started to chop down trees to make room for
> agriculture. Then when the excess population was becoming impossible,
> they began to quarrel and to kill each other. Then, to avoid civil
> wars, they started the industry of building statues bigger and bigger
> each year. This way, they got the young population busy carving the
> statues, and carrying them to coast. With this entertainment the
> retarded the time of reproducing of the young people. The trouble with
> the statues is they needed to cut trees to make rails and paths to
> carry the statues to the shore. They had also to chop down some trees
> to make ropes with the fibers of their bark. Then after a century and
> a half, the stopped carving statues.

> There were no more tree to chop on the island.

> the, during the night, people from a clan pulled down
> the statues of the rival clans. And little by little they were
> tumbling down all the statues and ended in a terrible and constant
> warfare, that nearly annihilated most of the population.
> This proves that human mind are not rational on collective issues.
> And that something as visible as very tall trees can be tumbled down
> with a stone chopper till there is not any more left on the island.
> This proves, that population does not stop ion their own, but by the
> way of little catastrophes.

> I am very pessimistic about the collective mind of humans is rational.