Looking for Energy Efficiency Information

Posted by Frank Taco on January 28, 2007, 11:08 pm

Thanks to all of you who replied with suggestions and comments.
That's a ton of great information to get me started.

DAC, I'm in eastern Washington state. Daily lows right now in the
lower 20's, highs in the low 30's, which is fairly typical for much of
the winter here with occassion dips into the teens and single digits.
Dry climate with relatively little wind. I would be building in an
older neighborhood on a 50' wide x 100' deep lot. Lots of mature
pine trees keep the lot partially shaded.

Posted by Dennis on February 1, 2007, 7:05 pm

Looking at the IRC (I don't know if Washington is using this code or not)
you are probably in Zone 5 which would require R-38 in the ceiling, R-19 in
the exterior walls, and R-30 in the floor (if over unheated exterior) or
R-10 for a basement wall. (Those are the minimums.)

As one commenter pointed out, R vales are misleading; especially in the
attic where it's most important. What is known is that porous insulation
such as fiberglass & and cellulose, allows heat too rise through it and this
slight airflow draws cold, outside air into the insulation. (Convection).

In this process, the colder it gets outside, the greater the convection, and
the lower the R values drops (in a study published by Oakridge National
Laboratory.)

Truthfully, the published R values on insulation is under ideal, testing
conditions, in sealed cavities and in dry air (which is almost never seen in
real-world conditions. For example, an R-19 wall (actually R-18 or R-17
after installation - due to compression from 6 inch or 6.5 inch expanded
thickness into a 5.5 inch cavity) will drop to an R-9 value at -18 deg F. (A
more realistic figure would be R-14 at 19 deg F.) Anyway, the R value does
drop due to air infiltrating the insulation; up to 1/2 when you need it
most.

http://www.monolithic.com/plan_design/rfairy/index.html

Much of the money spent for high values of insulation is actually wasted in
a cold climate. A better choice is to consider ICF or rigid foam (both have
certain drawbacks not readily apparent), or best, sprayed-in-place foam
(which does not suffer from these defects.) It does cost more, but remains
constant when exposed to very cold temperatures (unlike fiberglass &
cellulose) thereby returning it's extra cost faster than conventional
insulations. It's hard to beat a conventionally framed home insulated with
spray-in-place foam. Excellent R values, seals all points of infiltration
(excluding windows, doors and intentional air ducts).

There are several websites available on "green" housing, some (in
Washington) require NO extra energy to heat or cool (mostly solar and
passive) but they are documented. Energy efficiency STARTS with the design
of the home (the layout facing south has the greatest effect.) Super good
insulation and efficient doors and windows (a very large source of loss) and
your well on your way to recovering every extra dime you put into it. (Don't
overlook the solar aspect as it has a very important part in dropping (or
raising) energy costs if ignored in the design phase. Roof overhangs,
placement of glazing, mass storage (masonry walls), solar panels, all these
and so much more all play a part. (In an unrelated example, I seen a show on
cable where FedEx has an entire hub (large building) powered by solar and
actually sells electricity back to the local utility.

I would say a good payback is 10 years. (Wishful thinking but energy costs
are only going to go up in the future, so in ten years, you very well could
see a full return.)

> Thanks to all of you who replied with suggestions and comments.
> That's a ton of great information to get me started.
> DAC, I'm in eastern Washington state. Daily lows right now in the
> lower 20's, highs in the low 30's, which is fairly typical for much of
> the winter here with occassion dips into the teens and single digits.
> Dry climate with relatively little wind. I would be building in an
> older neighborhood on a 50' wide x 100' deep lot. Lots of mature
> pine trees keep the lot partially shaded.
>

Posted by abarr on January 29, 2007, 4:55 pm

For information on ICF go to www.futurestone.com or www.nudura.com. With
the thermal-mass of the concrete you will get walls that perform up to r-50.
That's better than any other type of construction.

> I'm considering building a new home on an empty lot next to my existing
> home. It would be my new residence and I would sell the home I am in
> now. Since the existing home is old and very inefficient, I am
> particularly interested in building a very energy efficient home. I am
> just beginning to research energy efficient construction methods and
> and hoping that some of you can steer me toward some websites that will
> help educate me on energy efficient construction methods and materials.
> Thanks in advance for your help.
>

Posted by DAC on January 31, 2007, 10:27 am

I'm finishing my ICF house and only hope for the r-50...but not
banking on it. Here's an article that indicate different findings
<http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/research/detailed_papers/thermal/

results.html>. Beware of the hype surrounding ICF or SIP constrution

methods.

At one site one time I was reading that in a typical 2x6 construction
in the mid 11's was the BEST anyone could get assuming the insulation
was installed PERFECTLY. I choose ICF for the sound deading
abilities, and to stop the air infiltration. Regardless, ceiling
insulation is increadibly important and I'll be putting in 14-16
inches of cellulose.

DAC

> For information on ICF go towww.futurestone.comorwww.nudura.com. With
> the thermal-mass of the concrete you will get walls that perform up to r-50.
> That's better than any other type of construction.

Posted by abarr on January 31, 2007, 1:47 pm

Good comments, you might consider using a open cell spray in foam it the
rafters of the house. Creates an envelope to hole in or keep out heat. If
you use ICF and don't do something significant in the attic you are just
moving the energy problem from the wall to the roof.

> I'm finishing my ICF house and only hope for the r-50...but not
> banking on it. Here's an article that indicate different findings
> <http://www.ornl.gov/sci/roofs+walls/research/detailed_papers/thermal/
> results.html>. Beware of the hype surrounding ICF or SIP constrution
> methods.
> At one site one time I was reading that in a typical 2x6 construction
> in the mid 11's was the BEST anyone could get assuming the insulation
> was installed PERFECTLY. I choose ICF for the sound deading
> abilities, and to stop the air infiltration. Regardless, ceiling
> insulation is increadibly important and I'll be putting in 14-16
> inches of cellulose.
> DAC

>> For information on ICF go towww.futurestone.comorwww.nudura.com. With
>> the thermal-mass of the concrete you will get walls that perform up to
>> r-50.
>> That's better than any other type of construction.

Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 > last >>

Similar Threads	Posted
Re: New WTC Information	September 8, 2006, 3:54 pm
High-Energy Mixing Concrete	January 23, 2007, 9:29 pm
Water Heater Energy Factor	December 28, 2007, 9:30 am
Free Energy Audit Software	November 28, 2008, 6:25 pm
Important Information	November 14, 2006, 8:02 am
Infrared Thermometer for finding energy leaks	October 23, 2007, 8:22 pm
Free Information website	October 4, 2007, 3:24 pm
Free Window Treatment Information.	November 16, 2007, 1:54 pm
Know everything about Building Information Modeling and its advantages.	November 4, 2008, 3:09 am
Architecture Building Information Modeling	July 24, 2009, 10:09 pm

Looking for Energy Efficiency Information - Page 2