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Posted by dpb on May 13, 2007, 9:55 am
> > ...
> > > I have been through several Skill, Craftsman, and Black Decker
> > > cordless tools over the past few years and been rather disappointed in
> > > all of them. Nine months ago I bought a combination set of tools from
> > > Ryobi and couldn't be happier with their performance. The overall
> > > qualitiy of the tools is good and their performance has been well
> > > above that of the previous tools.
> > ..
> > Well, w/ those as comparatives, you're in at least the same general
> > range of target market. TTI of course, began as a manufacturer for
> > Sears/Craftsman and then built the Ryobi brand and got the
> > distribution deal w/ HD from that experience/basis. While I haven't
> > looked in detail for several years now, it would be surprising to find
> > they're not still making a fair amount of stuff for Sears. I've not
> > investigated the Skil/B&D actual manufacturing relationships enough to
> > know of any possible connection in production facilities although one
> > would presume they're not contracting for them, even that wouldn't be
> > out of the realm of possibilities.
> I was talking with a plumbing company the other day who was also using
> Ryobi tools. Caught me by surprise that they would be using them
> since their load demand would far exceed mine. I ask them if they
> were happy with the tools and the quality. Their answer was that
> while the tools were not as good as say the Dewalt brand, their cost
> was so much lower that they could by three or four and still save
> money. Their experience had shown about 3/4 of the use at 1/4 of the
> cost. Still seems like a good value.
The cost ratio would seem high although could believe the use/
longevity might be roughly correct. Of course, one could get the cost
ratio to that point if comparing a K-Mart/Walmart-purchased homeowner
tool to a tool purchased at the plumbing distributorship.
Every business owner/contractor/etc. has to work out what is the most
cost-effective tool management program for their particular
situation. I know those who use the same "throw-away" scheme and
others who "buy best". In those instances, what is the difference
primarily of the ones I'm thinking of is the types of crews they have--
the "cheap but cheery" guy uses hourlies while the "pricey but strong"
guy has long-term employees. I hypothesize the labor and the personal
proclivities of the individuals has as much or more to do w/ the
longevity of the tool as the tool itself.
I simply compare how as an employer I have tools which I have owned/
used for in some cases 40 years that a particular hand has been able
to destroy (or nearly so) in a half-hour before it was rescued. Otoh,
others are also able to operate with impunity the same tool doing the
same job.
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Posted by z on May 15, 2007, 2:26 pm
> If I may sound off on this one,
> Personally where the tool is manufactured weighs in little for me. As
> much as I would prefer to buy American or Canadian, (keep our boys
> working) QUALITY will be my sole decider. I know China has meant, and
> in some cases still means cheap crap and deeper still human rights
> issues, etc. But the world is headed in that direction. And better and
> better stuff keeps coming from that manufacturing juggernaut know as
> cheap labor China. Often they are our companies, exploiting the labor
> cost difference. Anyway that said, I have been a BOSCH fan for years.
> I've recently been displeased with a few of their newer tools, but the
> Mitre Box for example, well... IMHO ,I dont think theres a better one
> on earth at any price point. I love mine.
Well, you don't have to be too old to remember when 'made in Japan'
was a synonym for piece of crap. That period went by pretty quickly,
in retrospect.
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Posted by Chris Lewis on May 15, 2007, 2:45 pm
> > If I may sound off on this one,
> > Personally where the tool is manufactured weighs in little for me. As
> > much as I would prefer to buy American or Canadian, (keep our boys
> > working) QUALITY will be my sole decider. I know China has meant, and
> > in some cases still means cheap crap and deeper still human rights
> > issues, etc. But the world is headed in that direction. And better and
> > better stuff keeps coming from that manufacturing juggernaut know as
> > cheap labor China. Often they are our companies, exploiting the labor
> > cost difference. Anyway that said, I have been a BOSCH fan for years.
> > I've recently been displeased with a few of their newer tools, but the
> > Mitre Box for example, well... IMHO ,I dont think theres a better one
> > on earth at any price point. I love mine.
>
> Well, you don't have to be too old to remember when 'made in Japan'
> was a synonym for piece of crap. That period went by pretty quickly,
> in retrospect.
Agreed. The shift is well on the way with Taiwan and Korea now, and
it _will_ happen with China too. The end result being high wages and
a certain amount of stagnation/regrouping as they meet or exceed
where we are now (in wages, QoL, prices etc). Question is whether our
economies will survive the phenomena with China, or instead, whether
it's our turn next.
--
Chris Lewis,
Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
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Posted by z on May 16, 2007, 10:18 am
On May 15, 2:45 pm, cle...@nortelnetworks.com (Chris Lewis) wrote:
> > > If I may sound off on this one,
> > > Personally where the tool is manufactured weighs in little for me. As
> > > much as I would prefer to buy American or Canadian, (keep our boys
> > > working) QUALITY will be my sole decider. I know China has meant, and
> > > in some cases still means cheap crap and deeper still human rights
> > > issues, etc. But the world is headed in that direction. And better and
> > > better stuff keeps coming from that manufacturing juggernaut know as
> > > cheap labor China. Often they are our companies, exploiting the labor
> > > cost difference. Anyway that said, I have been a BOSCH fan for years.
> > > I've recently been displeased with a few of their newer tools, but the
> > > Mitre Box for example, well... IMHO ,I dont think theres a better one
> > > on earth at any price point. I love mine.
> > Well, you don't have to be too old to remember when 'made in Japan'
> > was a synonym for piece of crap. That period went by pretty quickly,
> > in retrospect.
> Agreed. The shift is well on the way with Taiwan and Korea now, and
> it _will_ happen with China too. The end result being high wages and
> a certain amount of stagnation/regrouping as they meet or exceed
> where we are now (in wages, QoL, prices etc). Question is whether our
> economies will survive the phenomena with China, or instead, whether
> it's our turn next.
Of course our economies are going to get clobbered. The only thing
keeping our salaries and benefits and way of life as high as they are
is geographic isolation; the money is over here not over there, we are
over here, therefore we have more money. Thanks to modern
communications and transportation, that isolation is greatly reduced.
Eventually things will stabilize, but we're not going to live long
enough to see that period. In the meantime, it's going to be a bumpy
ride. Like when the industrial revolution displaced agriculture, or
when mechanization replaced hand labor.
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Posted by Chris Lewis on May 16, 2007, 2:45 pm
> Of course our economies are going to get clobbered. The only thing
> keeping our salaries and benefits and way of life as high as they are
> is geographic isolation; the money is over here not over there, we are
> over here, therefore we have more money.
Given that the US trade deficit in 2005 was $728B and is still
increasing, you seem to be doing your best to move it over "there" :-(
It'll stabilize, but it'll be bumpy getting there, and I have my
doubts whether you're going to be happy with the stabilized level.
--
Chris Lewis,
Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
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