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how to know if unknown wire is "neutral or ground"? Stan 08-26-2009
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Posted by Grasshopper on August 26, 2009, 11:22 pm


> I'm trying to add an outlet from 2 wires that are just hanging out of
> the wall. I followed the wires to the attic and only one wire goes to
> the attic. The other wire went somewhere else.
> I tested the wire and found out that it's either a ground or a
> neutral. How do I find out for sure if this is a "ground" or
> "neutral". If it's a neutral, then this outlet I'm trying to add is
> almost complete. If it's a ground then I'm in for another few hours of
> work.
> Thanks,
> stan

If you're talking about the duplex problem and which side of the duplex the
hot and unknown wire come from its relatively simple to determine regarding
a ground wire and a neutral wire.

All neutrals should connect electrically to the actual grounding rod via a
grounding connection inside the primary breaker box. This is a single wire
connection from the neutral terminal where all the neutrals connect. This
wire connects to the ground terminal bus. The ground terminal bus is
physically directly connected to the grounding rod. via a unsheathed copper
wire. With power removed, disconnect the wire connection from the neutral
side to the grounding side. After this is done re-energize the power panel.
Go check for the unknown wire for enabling power. If doesn't work now, its
a neutral. If it does, its a grounding wire. Reverse the procedure to
connect the neutral and grounding sides in the main breaker panel.

You have to check both main breaker panels this way for both sides of the
duplex. If it is a neutral, it will also tell you which duplex main breaker
panel it is originating from.

Simply denergizing either duplex breaker panel will tell which side the
"hot" is coming from.

Will help with the grounding wire question once you established the answer
to the neutral question.
--
Dave



Posted by Stan on August 27, 2009, 1:08 am


On Aug 26, 8:22=A0pm, "Grasshopper" <NONE> wrote:
> > I'm trying to add an outlet from 2 wires that are just hanging out of
> > the wall. I followed the wires to the attic and only one wire goes to
> > the attic. The other wire went somewhere else.
> > I tested the wire and found out that it's either a ground or a
> > neutral. How do I find out for sure if this is a "ground" or
> > "neutral". If it's a neutral, then this outlet I'm trying to add is
> > almost complete. If it's a ground then I'm in for another few hours of
> > work.
> > Thanks,
> > stan
> If you're talking about the duplex problem and which side of the duplex t=
he
> hot and unknown wire come from its relatively simple to determine regardi=
ng
> a ground wire and a neutral wire.
> All neutrals should connect electrically to the actual grounding =A0rod v=
ia a
> grounding connection inside the primary breaker box. =A0This is a single =
wire
> connection from the neutral terminal where all the neutrals connect. =A0T=
his
> wire connects to the ground terminal bus. =A0The ground terminal bus is
> physically directly connected to the grounding rod. via a unsheathed copp=
er
> wire. =A0With power removed, disconnect the wire connection from the neut=
ral
> side to the grounding side. =A0After this is done re-energize the power p=
anel.
> Go check for the unknown wire for enabling power. =A0If doesn't work now,=
its
> a neutral. =A0If it does, its a grounding wire. =A0Reverse the procedure =
to
> connect the neutral and grounding sides in the main breaker panel.
> You have to check both main breaker panels this way for both sides of the
> duplex. =A0If it is a neutral, it will also tell you which duplex main br=
eaker
> panel it is originating from.
> Simply denergizing either duplex breaker panel will tell which side the
> "hot" is coming from.
> Will help with the grounding wire question once you established the answe=
r
> to the neutral question.
> --
> Dave

Dave,
Thanks for you detailed answer. What I did was I disconnect all the
neutral's from both of the fuse box. (Since I live in a duplex.)
However, the problem is some of the electricity still works. I don't
know where it's getting the neutral from. One unit all the
electricity went dead. The other unit everything stayed on but 3
outlets and one light. Weird? Any other suggestions?

Posted by jamesgangnc on August 27, 2009, 1:04 pm


> On Aug 26, 8:22=A0pm, "Grasshopper" <NONE> wrote:
> > > I'm trying to add an outlet from 2 wires that are just hanging out of
> > > the wall. I followed the wires to the attic and only one wire goes to
> > > the attic. The other wire went somewhere else.
> > > I tested the wire and found out that it's either a ground or a
> > > neutral. How do I find out for sure if this is a "ground" or
> > > "neutral". If it's a neutral, then this outlet I'm trying to add is
> > > almost complete. If it's a ground then I'm in for another few hours o=
f
> > > work.
> > > Thanks,
> > > stan
> > If you're talking about the duplex problem and which side of the duplex=
the
> > hot and unknown wire come from its relatively simple to determine regar=
ding
> > a ground wire and a neutral wire.
> > All neutrals should connect electrically to the actual grounding =A0rod=
via a
> > grounding connection inside the primary breaker box. =A0This is a singl=
e wire
> > connection from the neutral terminal where all the neutrals connect. =
=A0This
> > wire connects to the ground terminal bus. =A0The ground terminal bus is
> > physically directly connected to the grounding rod. via a unsheathed co=
pper
> > wire. =A0With power removed, disconnect the wire connection from the ne=
utral
> > side to the grounding side. =A0After this is done re-energize the power=
panel.
> > Go check for the unknown wire for enabling power. =A0If doesn't work no=
w, its
> > a neutral. =A0If it does, its a grounding wire. =A0Reverse the procedur=
e to
> > connect the neutral and grounding sides in the main breaker panel.
> > You have to check both main breaker panels this way for both sides of t=
he
> > duplex. =A0If it is a neutral, it will also tell you which duplex main =
breaker
> > panel it is originating from.
> > Simply denergizing either duplex breaker panel will tell which side the
> > "hot" is coming from.
> > Will help with the grounding wire question once you established the ans=
wer
> > to the neutral question.
> > --
> > Dave
> Dave,
> Thanks for you detailed answer. =A0What I did was I disconnect all the
> neutral's from both of the fuse box. =A0(Since I live in a duplex.)
> However, the problem is some of the =A0electricity still works. =A0I don'=
t
> know where it's getting the neutral from. =A0One unit all the
> electricity went dead. =A0The other unit everything stayed on but 3
> outlets and one light. =A0Weird? =A0Any other suggestions?- Hide quoted t=
ext -
> - Show quoted text -

It is possible that devices remaining connected complete the circuit
between the two hots. The problem is that the load is likely unequal
and that will cause higher voltage on one side and lower voltage on
the other. Bad for some stuff.

Posted by Art on August 27, 2009, 9:03 pm


Stan wrote:
> Thanks for you detailed answer. What I did was I disconnect all the
> neutral's from both of the fuse box. (Since I live in a duplex.)
> However, the problem is some of the electricity still works. I don't
> know where it's getting the neutral from. One unit all the
> electricity went dead. The other unit everything stayed on but 3
> outlets and one light. Weird? Any other suggestions?

You need to disconnect the hot wires to kill the power, not the
neutrals. Disconnecting all the neutrals is foolish and dangerous. CALL
AN ELECTRICIAN YOU IDIOT!

Posted by F Murtz on August 28, 2009, 11:29 am


Stan wrote:
> On Aug 26, 8:22 pm, "Grasshopper" <NONE> wrote:
>>> I'm trying to add an outlet from 2 wires that are just hanging out of
>>> the wall. I followed the wires to the attic and only one wire goes to
>>> the attic. The other wire went somewhere else.
>>> I tested the wire and found out that it's either a ground or a
>>> neutral. How do I find out for sure if this is a "ground" or
>>> "neutral". If it's a neutral, then this outlet I'm trying to add is
>>> almost complete. If it's a ground then I'm in for another few hours of
>>> work.
>>> Thanks,
>>> stan
>> If you're talking about the duplex problem and which side of the duplex the
>> hot and unknown wire come from its relatively simple to determine regarding
>> a ground wire and a neutral wire.
>> All neutrals should connect electrically to the actual grounding rod via a
>> grounding connection inside the primary breaker box. This is a single wire
>> connection from the neutral terminal where all the neutrals connect. This
>> wire connects to the ground terminal bus. The ground terminal bus is
>> physically directly connected to the grounding rod. via a unsheathed copper
>> wire. With power removed, disconnect the wire connection from the neutral
>> side to the grounding side. After this is done re-energize the power panel.
>> Go check for the unknown wire for enabling power. If doesn't work now, its
>> a neutral. If it does, its a grounding wire. Reverse the procedure to
>> connect the neutral and grounding sides in the main breaker panel.
>> You have to check both main breaker panels this way for both sides of the
>> duplex. If it is a neutral, it will also tell you which duplex main breaker
>> panel it is originating from.
>> Simply denergizing either duplex breaker panel will tell which side the
>> "hot" is coming from.
>> Will help with the grounding wire question once you established the answer
>> to the neutral question.
>> --
>> Dave
>
> Dave,
> Thanks for you detailed answer. What I did was I disconnect all the
> neutral's from both of the fuse box. (Since I live in a duplex.)
> However, the problem is some of the electricity still works. I don't
> know where it's getting the neutral from. One unit all the
> electricity went dead. The other unit everything stayed on but 3
> outlets and one light. Weird? Any other suggestions?

Join a club, shooting, chess, cooking or knitting etc, make friends with
an electrician (or you could go to tech and learn the business)

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