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Braze or solder copper refrigerant lines to fittings

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Braze or solder copper refrigerant lines to fittings henny 12-24-2006
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Posted by Jake on December 25, 2006, 9:27 pm
henny wrote:
> You all seem to be split as to which method is easier to learn and
> more forgiving.
>
> I do have Nitrogen so I'm not worried about oxidation. I also have
> oxy/acet.tanks and equipment but the thought of using a #2 tip on soft
> thin copper makes me a little nervous. (my welding skills aren't that
> great so I doubt my brazing skills will be much better).
>
> I think I'll start my practice sessions using SilPhos 15 and a small
> rosebud or turbo torch.
>
> Once again I'm simply looking for the method that's most forgiving to
> a novice for a one time job and that can be readily learned via a few
> practice sessions. I have no intentions of doing this for a living.
>
> Thanks for the responses.
>
>

Henny,

I learned a great deal from the people here on how to do this properly.
Most of it you can probably Google up..

As for advice... Noone's worked for me best. If you've used oxy/acet at
all it's a much better heat source, IMO.

Doing a closed system. ALWAYS purge with Nitrogen. Depending on the line
size, I've successfully used 5-15 psi continuously during your job. Pull
a Schrader core out and let the gas vent immediately down-stream.

Once done, purge the system for a while and then pull it into a vacuum
right away. Leave the system alone for a while and make certain the
vacuum holds.

Whatever the gas or liquid in a closed system... do not let things like
AIR infiltrate. Whether it's a pump or compressor, it can cause bad
problems.

Charge the gas or liquid directly into the highest possible vacuum the
system will achieve. This applies to water, oil-hydraulic and gas/liquid
HVAC systems all the same.

Some of the guys here might disagree with me here... but it's what
should be good practice for learning.

Jake



Posted by Steve Scott on December 26, 2006, 10:01 pm
I'll second that. Use some silver braze with N2 and oxy-acetylene and
a #2 tip. Practice a bit on some scrap. It's not that hard.
Remember you're not trying to sweat it in like solder.

The only thing I would differ from what Jake's suggesting is I like to
pressurize the system with N2 after brazing. You'll find an
occasional leak that won't show up when pulling a vacuum. Plus if you
do have a leak you're not pulling air and moisture in.


>henny wrote:
>> You all seem to be split as to which method is easier to learn and
>> more forgiving.
>>
>> I do have Nitrogen so I'm not worried about oxidation. I also have
>> oxy/acet.tanks and equipment but the thought of using a #2 tip on soft
>> thin copper makes me a little nervous. (my welding skills aren't that
>> great so I doubt my brazing skills will be much better).
>>
>> I think I'll start my practice sessions using SilPhos 15 and a small
>> rosebud or turbo torch.
>>
>> Once again I'm simply looking for the method that's most forgiving to
>> a novice for a one time job and that can be readily learned via a few
>> practice sessions. I have no intentions of doing this for a living.
>>
>> Thanks for the responses.
>>
>>
>
>Henny,
>
>I learned a great deal from the people here on how to do this properly.
>Most of it you can probably Google up..
>
>As for advice... Noone's worked for me best. If you've used oxy/acet at
>all it's a much better heat source, IMO.
>
>Doing a closed system. ALWAYS purge with Nitrogen. Depending on the line
>size, I've successfully used 5-15 psi continuously during your job. Pull
>a Schrader core out and let the gas vent immediately down-stream.
>
>Once done, purge the system for a while and then pull it into a vacuum
>right away. Leave the system alone for a while and make certain the
>vacuum holds.
>
>Whatever the gas or liquid in a closed system... do not let things like
>AIR infiltrate. Whether it's a pump or compressor, it can cause bad
>problems.
>
>Charge the gas or liquid directly into the highest possible vacuum the
>system will achieve. This applies to water, oil-hydraulic and gas/liquid
>HVAC systems all the same.
>
>Some of the guys here might disagree with me here... but it's what
>should be good practice for learning.
>
>Jake
>


--
Time flies when you don't know what
you're doing.





Posted by cz111 on August 5, 2008, 1:47 pm


cz111 had written this in response to
http://www.thestuccocompany.com/hvac/Braze-or-solder-copper-refrigerant-lines-to-fittings-10462-.htm
:


-------------------------------------
henny wrote:


> It seems like the two primary methods for connecting copper to copper
> refrigerant lines to fittings are either Sil Phos 15 brazing rod or
> Stay Brite silver solder.

> I've done gas welding and some plumbing soldering jobs but would only
> rate myself as a novice.

> Which method is easier for a novice to do reliably? (Sil Phos or
> Staybrite silver solder.)

> I plan to do lots of practice on scrap copper pipe and fittings until
> I'm proficient. I'd like to know which method is easier to learn and
> do reliably so I have a good starting point.

> For brazing copper lines (3/8 to 1-1/8" in diameter) what oxy/acet
> tip
> do you prefer to use. (small rosebud??) Will a Turbo Torch w/ #4
> tip and MAPP gas braze using Sil Phos 15? What about the Quick
> Braze?? Is it worth getting??


I was told by a heating and cooling repairman (who has lied to me more
than once) and his boss that torch brazing copper tubing does not require
the tubes to be cleaned or fluxed because the high temperature along with
a 'special silver soder' will eliminate all oxidization, oils, etc... Any
comments???







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Posted by Stormin Mormon on August 5, 2008, 7:44 pm


The 15% silver braze sticks I bought years ago said they were "self
fluxing". But, I have never taken the chance that they might be mistaken.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.




I was told by a heating and cooling repairman (who has lied to me more
than once) and his boss that torch brazing copper tubing does not require
the tubes to be cleaned or fluxed because the high temperature along with
a 'special silver soder' will eliminate all oxidization, oils, etc... Any
comments???







##-----------------------------------------------##
Delivered via http://www.thestuccocompany.com/
Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
sci.engr.joining.welding,alt.hvac - messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##



Posted by Petre on August 6, 2008, 12:49 am


Stormin Mormon wrote:
> The 15% silver braze sticks I bought years ago said they were "self
> fluxing". But, I have never taken the chance that they might be mistaken.
>


Whatttt?? You gotta be kidding. This is for copper brazed AC lines?
I do hope you ran some nitrogen through those lines. Dammit Steve, Your
Apprentice is running Amok.,
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

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