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Posted by on September 1, 2008, 1:11 pm
About two years ago the capacitor on our external AC condenser failed
and was replaced. The unit has ran fine since then. Last night the
fan stopped and the unit began making more noise.
Poking the fan blades showed they spin quite freely. Am I right in
assuming that since the unit was still making noise that it can't be a
relay (was dark, but if there were any it looked like only one in the
unit), that the only thing remaining is either this 2 year old
capacitor or the motor itself?
Motor is about 15 years old, looks like a typical GE 220V 1.4A 1/4
HP. Opening it up it looks fine inside, though a problem in the
windings might not be something I could see. I have basic electronics
skills, is there a way to test the integrity of the motor or
reasonably run it outside the condenser?
The run capacitor on these is about 5uF, or at least that's the motor
spec'd value. Will this type of capacitor read normally out of
circuit with a capacitance meter, and if it's value was within
tolerance can the capacitor then be assumed in good operable
condition?
Am I correct in assuming that if I momentarily turn the AC on without
the fan hooked up at all (being sure to turn it off again before the
compressor overheats due to no airflow) that if I measure the expected
220V at the motor hookup points, this is another indication it has to
be either the capacitor or motor itself? With the motor open, with
the armature removed from the stator, between three wires I'm getting
resistance readings of 28 Ohm, 56Ohm, 84 Ohm. These look right for a
typical 1 phase condenser motor, being all three multiples of 28 Ohm,
correct?
The last capacitor was obviously, visually bad as indicated by it
bulging. The new (2 year old) one looks mint still. Does anyone have
further ideas for troubleshooting this besides swapping in a new motor
and/or capacitor, and which do you think is the cause?
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Posted by Noon-Air on September 1, 2008, 1:51 pm
> About two years ago the capacitor on our external AC condenser failed
> and was replaced. The unit has ran fine since then. Last night the
> fan stopped and the unit began making more noise.
> Poking the fan blades showed they spin quite freely. Am I right in
> assuming that since the unit was still making noise that it can't be a
> relay (was dark, but if there were any it looked like only one in the
> unit), that the only thing remaining is either this 2 year old
> capacitor or the motor itself?
> Motor is about 15 years old, looks like a typical GE 220V 1.4A 1/4
> HP. Opening it up it looks fine inside, though a problem in the
> windings might not be something I could see. I have basic electronics
> skills, is there a way to test the integrity of the motor or
> reasonably run it outside the condenser?
> The run capacitor on these is about 5uF, or at least that's the motor
> spec'd value. Will this type of capacitor read normally out of
> circuit with a capacitance meter, and if it's value was within
> tolerance can the capacitor then be assumed in good operable
> condition?
> Am I correct in assuming that if I momentarily turn the AC on without
> the fan hooked up at all (being sure to turn it off again before the
> compressor overheats due to no airflow) that if I measure the expected
> 220V at the motor hookup points, this is another indication it has to
> be either the capacitor or motor itself? With the motor open, with
> the armature removed from the stator, between three wires I'm getting
> resistance readings of 28 Ohm, 56Ohm, 84 Ohm. These look right for a
> typical 1 phase condenser motor, being all three multiples of 28 Ohm,
> correct?
> The last capacitor was obviously, visually bad as indicated by it
> bulging. The new (2 year old) one looks mint still. Does anyone have
> further ideas for troubleshooting this besides swapping in a new motor
> and/or capacitor, and which do you think is the cause?
yup
the system is getting on in age and close to the end of its design life
cycle. Were it me, I would probably install a new motor and capacitor, then
start putting a bunch of money in the bank to replace the system.
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Posted by on September 1, 2008, 3:59 pm
> > About two years ago the capacitor on our external AC condenser failed
> > and was replaced. =A0The unit has ran fine since then. =A0Last night th=
e
> > fan stopped and the unit began making more noise.
> > Poking the fan blades showed they spin quite freely. =A0Am I right in
> > assuming that since the unit was still making noise that it can't be a
> > relay (was dark, but if there were any it looked like only one in the
> > unit), that the only thing remaining is either this 2 year old
> > capacitor or the motor itself?
> > Motor is about 15 years old, looks like a typical GE 220V 1.4A 1/4
> > HP. =A0Opening it up it looks fine inside, though a problem in the
> > windings might not be something I could see. =A0I have basic electronic=
s
> > skills, is there a way to test the integrity of the motor or
> > reasonably run it outside the condenser?
> > The run capacitor on these is about 5uF, or at least that's the motor
> > spec'd value. =A0Will this type of capacitor read normally out of
> > circuit with a capacitance meter, and if it's value was within
> > tolerance can the capacitor then be assumed in good operable
> > condition?
> > Am I correct in assuming that if I momentarily turn the AC on without
> > the fan hooked up at all (being sure to turn it off again before the
> > compressor overheats due to no airflow) that if I measure the expected
> > 220V at the motor hookup points, this is another indication it has to
> > be either the capacitor or motor itself? =A0With the motor open, with
> > the armature removed from the stator, between three wires I'm getting
> > resistance readings of 28 Ohm, 56Ohm, 84 Ohm. =A0These look right for a
> > typical 1 phase condenser motor, being all three multiples of 28 Ohm,
> > correct?
> > The last capacitor was obviously, visually bad as indicated by it
> > bulging. =A0The new (2 year old) one looks mint still. =A0Does anyone h=
ave
> > further ideas for troubleshooting this besides swapping in a new motor
> > and/or capacitor, and which do you think is the cause?
> yup
> the system is getting on in age and close to the end of its design life
> cycle. Were it me, I would probably install a new motor and capacitor, th=
en
> start putting a bunch of money in the bank to replace the system.- Hide q=
uoted text -
> - Show quoted text -
Thanks for your reply. It seems my multimeter capacitance setting
doesn't range up to 45uF, and I wasn't even sure if it was working
properly as it didn't read the 5uF on the dual capacitor, so I dug out
another meter and checked a different run capacitor I had lying
around. I also found a short on the dual cap's fan motor run and
common terminals so it looks like a safe bet the capacitor is shot.
Do you/anyone know if there are significant differences in quality
among the various capacitors out there? The first one lasted 13
years, AFAIK, and this replacement only 2 years. I did a web search
and found the exact same cap selling online for $17 so it's definitely
one of the cheapest of it's kind.
http://ctcsupply.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=3Dprcfd455&Submit.=
x=3D12&Submit.y=3D4
I'd just rather spend more if it'll make a difference then not have to
fool with it again for more than a couple years. It's value is
45/5uF, 440V, dual round can (though oval would work, I'm not /that/
picky). Then again it's still summer, 90F+ here so whatever I can
find locally is better than waiting. I'll wait-n-see on the fan motor
though, think I sourced a replacement if it comes to that.
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Posted by Noon-Air on September 1, 2008, 4:16 pm
> > About two years ago the capacitor on our external AC condenser failed
> > and was replaced. The unit has ran fine since then. Last night the
> > fan stopped and the unit began making more noise.
> > Poking the fan blades showed they spin quite freely. Am I right in
> > assuming that since the unit was still making noise that it can't be a
> > relay (was dark, but if there were any it looked like only one in the
> > unit), that the only thing remaining is either this 2 year old
> > capacitor or the motor itself?
> > Motor is about 15 years old, looks like a typical GE 220V 1.4A 1/4
> > HP. Opening it up it looks fine inside, though a problem in the
> > windings might not be something I could see. I have basic electronics
> > skills, is there a way to test the integrity of the motor or
> > reasonably run it outside the condenser?
> > The run capacitor on these is about 5uF, or at least that's the motor
> > spec'd value. Will this type of capacitor read normally out of
> > circuit with a capacitance meter, and if it's value was within
> > tolerance can the capacitor then be assumed in good operable
> > condition?
> > Am I correct in assuming that if I momentarily turn the AC on without
> > the fan hooked up at all (being sure to turn it off again before the
> > compressor overheats due to no airflow) that if I measure the expected
> > 220V at the motor hookup points, this is another indication it has to
> > be either the capacitor or motor itself? With the motor open, with
> > the armature removed from the stator, between three wires I'm getting
> > resistance readings of 28 Ohm, 56Ohm, 84 Ohm. These look right for a
> > typical 1 phase condenser motor, being all three multiples of 28 Ohm,
> > correct?
> > The last capacitor was obviously, visually bad as indicated by it
> > bulging. The new (2 year old) one looks mint still. Does anyone have
> > further ideas for troubleshooting this besides swapping in a new motor
> > and/or capacitor, and which do you think is the cause?
> yup
> the system is getting on in age and close to the end of its design life
> cycle. Were it me, I would probably install a new motor and capacitor,
> then
> start putting a bunch of money in the bank to replace the system.- Hide
> quoted text -
> - Show quoted text -
Thanks for your reply. It seems my multimeter capacitance setting
doesn't range up to 45uF, and I wasn't even sure if it was working
properly as it didn't read the 5uF on the dual capacitor, so I dug out
another meter and checked a different run capacitor I had lying
around. I also found a short on the dual cap's fan motor run and
common terminals so it looks like a safe bet the capacitor is shot.
Do you/anyone know if there are significant differences in quality
among the various capacitors out there? The first one lasted 13
years, AFAIK, and this replacement only 2 years. I did a web search
and found the exact same cap selling online for $17 so it's definitely
one of the cheapest of it's kind.
http://ctcsupply.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=prcfd455&Submit.x=12&Submit.y=4
I'd just rather spend more if it'll make a difference then not have to
fool with it again for more than a couple years. It's value is
45/5uF, 440V, dual round can (though oval would work, I'm not /that/
picky). Then again it's still summer, 90F+ here so whatever I can
find locally is better than waiting. I'll wait-n-see on the fan motor
though, think I sourced a replacement if it comes to that.
Try a Rheem/RUUD part number 43-25133-16. I have never had one of those
fail.
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Posted by Stormin Mormon on September 1, 2008, 5:32 pm
Hmm. 45/5? I just bought a couple of those last week. I was cleaning the
condensor (sorry boys) on a Trane unit, and that's the size it took. Figured
I ought to have one available for the next customer who needed one. How did
things work out, now that you have the new cap installed?
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.
Thanks for your reply. It seems my multimeter capacitance setting
doesn't range up to 45uF, and I wasn't even sure if it was working
properly as it didn't read the 5uF on the dual capacitor, so I dug out
another meter and checked a different run capacitor I had lying
around. I also found a short on the dual cap's fan motor run and
common terminals so it looks like a safe bet the capacitor is shot.
Do you/anyone know if there are significant differences in quality
among the various capacitors out there? The first one lasted 13
years, AFAIK, and this replacement only 2 years. I did a web search
and found the exact same cap selling online for $17 so it's definitely
one of the cheapest of it's kind.
http://ctcsupply.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=prcfd455&Submit.x=12&Submit.y=4
I'd just rather spend more if it'll make a difference then not have to
fool with it again for more than a couple years. It's value is
45/5uF, 440V, dual round can (though oval would work, I'm not /that/
picky). Then again it's still summer, 90F+ here so whatever I can
find locally is better than waiting. I'll wait-n-see on the fan motor
though, think I sourced a replacement if it comes to that.
|
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> and was replaced. The unit has ran fine since then. Last night the
> fan stopped and the unit began making more noise.
> Poking the fan blades showed they spin quite freely. Am I right in
> assuming that since the unit was still making noise that it can't be a
> relay (was dark, but if there were any it looked like only one in the
> unit), that the only thing remaining is either this 2 year old
> capacitor or the motor itself?
> Motor is about 15 years old, looks like a typical GE 220V 1.4A 1/4
> HP. Opening it up it looks fine inside, though a problem in the
> windings might not be something I could see. I have basic electronics
> skills, is there a way to test the integrity of the motor or
> reasonably run it outside the condenser?
> The run capacitor on these is about 5uF, or at least that's the motor
> spec'd value. Will this type of capacitor read normally out of
> circuit with a capacitance meter, and if it's value was within
> tolerance can the capacitor then be assumed in good operable
> condition?
> Am I correct in assuming that if I momentarily turn the AC on without
> the fan hooked up at all (being sure to turn it off again before the
> compressor overheats due to no airflow) that if I measure the expected
> 220V at the motor hookup points, this is another indication it has to
> be either the capacitor or motor itself? With the motor open, with
> the armature removed from the stator, between three wires I'm getting
> resistance readings of 28 Ohm, 56Ohm, 84 Ohm. These look right for a
> typical 1 phase condenser motor, being all three multiples of 28 Ohm,
> correct?
> The last capacitor was obviously, visually bad as indicated by it
> bulging. The new (2 year old) one looks mint still. Does anyone have
> further ideas for troubleshooting this besides swapping in a new motor
> and/or capacitor, and which do you think is the cause?