Geothermal Installations During Hard Economic Times - Page 4

> Hello All,
> I have been reading a lot of posts regarding Geothermal on forums and
> receiving hundreds of calls from consumers and contractors so here it goes
> During these hard economic times. HVAC contractors are forced to look for
> other revenue avenues. Unfortunately the geothermal field is taking a hard
> hit.Not Good in most cases Under trained contractors are jumping into this
> field without the knowledge or experience needed to install these systems
> properly. The homeowner will be the one disappointed when they do not get
> the savings promised. We just finished reinstalling a geothermal that was
> installed incorrectly. The loop field was put in by a hvac contractor and
> a local well driller whom has no knowledge about geothermal loops and
> never ever had put a system it before. The home owner was very upset when
> everything needed to be redone. These contractors are giving geothermal a
> bad name.
> I am a Geothermal Contractor Northwest Geothermal Inc. In Northwest
> Indiana I used to sell and service furnaces about 12 years ago. We
> serviced geothermal systems during those years also. Well I decided to
> install a complete geothermal system into my new home. WOW! The saving was
> great and the Comfort was awesome. I was warm at a low cost. So after a
> full year of quality geothermal training, yes I said a full year it takes
> for quality training. We started installing geothermal systems only. We
> changed our company name to Northwest Geothermal Inc. and history was
> changed for the best for us it has now been over 12 years as just a
> geothermal sales and service company. We complete all of our own loop
> installations. NO sub-contractors. We have our own Drilling rig's and
> backhoe's. I am a licensed well driller also. My caution to all of you who
> are thinking of getting into geothermal is do your home work and lots of
> training. You will here about the typical 150' to 200' ground loops per
> ton to put into the ground. FORGET IT THERE I
> S NO SUCH THING AS TYPICAL. If you use this typical thinking you will fail
> and your loops and they will fail. no question
> The proper and only way to size a geothermal system for a home and ground
> loop is to do a manual J load no questions asked. Then put your numbers
> into your purchased Climate Master geothermal or other software program
> not some free thing you downloaded off the internet then you are on your
> way to success and profits. Also the other myth in my opinion is an OPEN
> LOOP, pump and dump; discharge system what ever you want to call it that
> it is more efficient to operate and saves the customer more money. Well
> FORGET IT 95% percent of our service work is on open loop systems. Sure
> lets put an open loop on the bench and operate the system and have a
> constant water temp run thru it. Test it, Take a reading. OK now back to
> reality put it in the field under size piping, very hard water conditions
> ,lots of iron build up, now the system has iron and other minerals
> build-up in the walls of the coax coil and is lined. with these issues,
> now you just lost efficiency! Now the home owner is calling you back 6
> months later. Its coming out cold and or
> my electric bill is sky high because the electric emergency back-up heat
> strips kicked in. OH NO! Now what ! Time for a service call to clean the
> heat exchanger with what? No, ice maker cleaner will not work! Well let's
> use harsh chemicals like muriatic acid, lime away, etc unsafe chemicals
> and also to mention when putting these chemicals into the unit it void's
> most manf. Warranty's because when you add these chemicals the copper and
> cuper nickel coil. Now you just pitted the walls, Okay now your clean and
> the systems running and its time for you to give the home owner there bill
> for cleaning, What do you think there are going to say? Well I'm not
> trying to scare any one away from Geothermal but there is a lot of
> training to become a geothermal installer. My company has produced a
> Biodegradable Geothermal open loop cleaner called Geothermal Green Clean
> and it is safe for the equipment and the user with no harsh acids and it
> can be found at www.GeothermalGreenClean.com . We also have on site
> training classes. The moral to the stor
> y is, I'm making lots of money servicing other contractor geothermal
> mistakes. When I get there the consumer is not happy and also to mention
> the neighbors they told the system does not work! I did not even mention
> the duct sizing issues. That's an entire issue that needs to be done
> correctly, so please do your home work and training .Yes the cost is
> higher to install geothermal upfront but in most cases I can show the
> consumer the payback period in writing is around 5 to 6 years and all the
> tax benefits local, state, federal and up to 75% saving every month using
> ClimateMaster Geothermal Units as to date we never had a geothermal unit
> failure or a geothermal loop leak or failure.
> We are proud and stand behind all our installs.
> You can be successful with geothermal as long as you don't cut corners.
> God Bless.
> Sincerely,
> George Kontol Jr.
> Northwest Geothermal Inc.
> Wind Power- Solar Energy-Geothermal Drilling
> DeMotte, In. 46310
> 219-987-2822
> www.NorthwestGeothermal.com
> www.GeothermalGreenClean.com
> -------------------------------------
> ##-----------------------------------------------##
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> Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
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> alt.hvac - 28113 messages and counting!
> ##-----------------------------------------------##

> First off, everybody has to deal with hacks. Fortunately, most of those
> around here have gone broke and are no longer around.... as far as
> economic hard times, yeah its been kind of rough for the last 6 months,
> but I don't know... for my company, Business has made a sharp
> turnaround. I have targeted the replacement market with different
> advertising. I have sold 6 new heat pump systems in the last week and a
> half. and am picking up a deposit check for another one this afternoon.
> You can sit on your ass and watch the world go by, or you can do something
> about it. All things come to those who work like hell while they wait.

>Hello All,
>I have been reading a lot of posts regarding Geothermal on forums and
>receiving hundreds of calls from consumers and contractors so here it goes
>During these hard economic times. HVAC contractors are forced to look for
>other revenue avenues. Unfortunately the geothermal field is taking a hard
>hit.Not Good in most cases Under trained contractors are jumping into this
>field without the knowledge or experience needed to install these systems
>properly. The homeowner will be the one disappointed when they do not get
>the savings promised. We just finished reinstalling a geothermal that was
>installed incorrectly. The loop field was put in by a hvac contractor and
>a local well driller whom has no knowledge about geothermal loops and
>never ever had put a system it before. The home owner was very upset when
>everything needed to be redone. These contractors are giving geothermal a
>bad name.
>I am a Geothermal Contractor Northwest Geothermal Inc. In Northwest
>Indiana I used to sell and service furnaces about 12 years ago. We
>serviced geothermal systems during those years also. Well I decided to
>install a complete geothermal system into my new home. WOW! The saving was
>great and the Comfort was awesome. I was warm at a low cost. So after a
>full year of quality geothermal training, yes I said a full year it takes
>for quality training. We started installing geothermal systems only. We
>changed our company name to Northwest Geothermal Inc. and history was
>changed for the best for us it has now been over 12 years as just a
>geothermal sales and service company. We complete all of our own loop
>installations. NO sub-contractors. We have our own Drilling rig’s and
>backhoe’s. I am a licensed well driller also. My caution to all of you who
>are thinking of getting into geothermal is do your home work and lots of
>training. You will here about the typical 150' to 200' ground loops per
>ton to put into the ground. FORGET IT THERE I
>S NO SUCH THING AS TYPICAL. If you use this typical thinking you will fail
>and your loops and they will fail. no question
>The proper and only way to size a geothermal system for a home and ground
>loop is to do a manual J load no questions asked. Then put your numbers
>into your purchased Climate Master geothermal or other software program
>not some free thing you downloaded off the internet then you are on your
>way to success and profits. Also the other myth in my opinion is an OPEN
>LOOP, pump and dump; discharge system what ever you want to call it that
>it is more efficient to operate and saves the customer more money. Well
>FORGET IT 95% percent of our service work is on open loop systems. Sure
>lets put an open loop on the bench and operate the system and have a
>constant water temp run thru it. Test it, Take a reading. OK now back to
>reality put it in the field under size piping, very hard water conditions
>,lots of iron build up, now the system has iron and other minerals
>build-up in the walls of the coax coil and is lined. with these issues,
>now you just lost efficiency! Now the home owner is calling you back 6
>months later. Its coming out cold and or
>my electric bill is sky high because the electric emergency back-up heat
>strips kicked in. OH NO! Now what ! Time for a service call to clean the
>heat exchanger with what? No, ice maker cleaner will not work! Well let’s
>use harsh chemicals like muriatic acid, lime away, etc unsafe chemicals
>and also to mention when putting these chemicals into the unit it void's
>most manf. Warranty’s because when you add these chemicals the copper and
>cuper nickel coil. Now you just pitted the walls, Okay now your clean and
>the systems running and its time for you to give the home owner there bill
>for cleaning, What do you think there are going to say? Well I’m not
>trying to scare any one away from Geothermal but there is a lot of
>training to become a geothermal installer. My company has produced a
>Biodegradable Geothermal open loop cleaner called Geothermal Green Clean
>and it is safe for the equipment and the user with no harsh acids and it
>can be found at www.GeothermalGreenClean.com . We also have on site
>training classes. The moral to the stor
>y is, I’m making lots of money servicing other contractor geothermal
>mistakes. When I get there the consumer is not happy and also to mention
>the neighbors they told the system does not work! I did not even mention
>the duct sizing issues. That’s an entire issue that needs to be done
>correctly, so please do your home work and training .Yes the cost is
>higher to install geothermal upfront but in most cases I can show the
>consumer the payback period in writing is around 5 to 6 years and all the
>tax benefits local, state, federal and up to 75% saving every month using
>ClimateMaster Geothermal Units as to date we never had a geothermal unit
>failure or a geothermal loop leak or failure.
>We are proud and stand behind all our installs.
>You can be successful with geothermal as long as you don’t cut corners.
>God Bless.
>Sincerely,
>George Kontol Jr.
>Northwest Geothermal Inc.
>Wind Power- Solar Energy-Geothermal Drilling
>DeMotte, In. 46310
>219-987-2822
>www.NorthwestGeothermal.com
>www.GeothermalGreenClean.com
>-------------------------------------
>##-----------------------------------------------##
>Delivered via http://www.thestuccocompany.com/
>Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
>Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
>alt.hvac - 28113 messages and counting!
>##-----------------------------------------------##

> All that drivel to peddle your $240.00 5 gal bucket of snake oil.
> What some of you kids wont do to advertise.
> Bubba