Heat Pump + Aux Heat Problem - Can You Help?

Posted by David White on December 25, 2008, 9:43 am

doh! wrote:

>> Injun Ear wrote:

>>> Come on, guys, how bout giving him a straight answer. It's probably
>>> going through a defrost cycle. Your HVAC guy can adjust it so that the
>>> heat strips kick in when it's in defrost so you don't feel so cold.

>> Thanks. I have tried putting the thing into emergency heat mode and I
>> find that this both gets heat coming from the registers but also gets
>> the aux heat indicator showing on the thermostat. So it seems that at
>> least part of the thermostat is ok and that the heater is working. But I
>> am not sure what to conclude must be wrong here. Happy holidays!

>
> Most likely there's nothing at all wrong with your thermostat--but with a
> trane / american standard then in order to get your electric strips to come
> on during condensor defrost you need to connect the black wire ( defrost
> signal ) at the condensing unit outside up to the aux heat terminal at the
> inside air handler--probably you'll find there is a spare white wire that
> you can use for this.
>
> --
>
>

Thanks for your tip and happy holidays to you. Can you think of any
reason why this would have been working fine and suddenly stops working?
Perhaps it is in some way due to this very long and cold spell we have
had here in Seattle recently? I have to believe that this has been wired
correctly as I know I have seen the aux heat indicator come on the
thermostat before. I remember having to look it up in the thermostat
manual to find out what it means. Cheers!

Posted by David White on December 25, 2008, 10:32 am

David White wrote:

> doh! wrote:

>>> Injun Ear wrote:
>>>> Come on, guys, how bout giving him a straight answer. It's probably
>>>> going through a defrost cycle. Your HVAC guy can adjust it so that the
>>>> heat strips kick in when it's in defrost so you don't feel so cold.
>>> Thanks. I have tried putting the thing into emergency heat mode and I
>>> find that this both gets heat coming from the registers but also gets
>>> the aux heat indicator showing on the thermostat. So it seems that at
>>> least part of the thermostat is ok and that the heater is working. But I
>>> am not sure what to conclude must be wrong here. Happy holidays!

>> Most likely there's nothing at all wrong with your thermostat--but with a
>> trane / american standard then in order to get your electric strips to
>> come
>> on during condensor defrost you need to connect the black wire ( defrost
>> signal ) at the condensing unit outside up to the aux heat terminal at
>> the
>> inside air handler--probably you'll find there is a spare white wire that
>> you can use for this.
>> --

> Thanks for your tip and happy holidays to you. Can you think of any
> reason why this would have been working fine and suddenly stops working?
> Perhaps it is in some way due to this very long and cold spell we have
> had here in Seattle recently? I have to believe that this has been wired
> correctly as I know I have seen the aux heat indicator come on the
> thermostat before. I remember having to look it up in the thermostat
> manual to find out what it means. Cheers!

Thanks once again for your responses. I just found some info on the
internet here

<http://en.allexperts.com/q/Heating-Air-Conditioning-696/2008/2/Heat-pump-thermostat-control.htm>

and here

<http://en.allexperts.com/q/Heating-Air-Conditioning-696/2008/2/Heat-pump-thermostat-control.htm>

that made me start checking things more carefully.

When this cold spell hit, I raised the temperatures on my thermostat
schedules. I have never done this before. Under the previous schedule, I
had simply raised the temp manually on the thermostat to what I wanted
when needed. Thinking back, this is when I typically saw the aux heat
indicator show on the thermostat.

So I just manually raised the temperature from its current setting by a
couple degrees and indeed the thermostat does show the aux heat
indicator. For this reason, I am thinking that the aux heater does, in
fact, work.

However, I am not sure about if it is working during the defrost cycle
of the heat pump. I only found out recently that there was such a thing.
I may never have noticed it before because it has never been this cold
this long since I have been in this house with the heat pump. Maybe the
heat pump only has to go through a defrost cycle when it is very cold.
Or maybe it does it frequently but I have only noticed it now because
the air being used right now is so very cold.

Do I have to call in a pro to see it the thing is properly set/wired so
that the aux heat comes on during the defrost cycle? Or is there some
way I can check that?

Thanks and happy holidays to all!

Posted by doh! on December 25, 2008, 10:58 am

> David White wrote:

> > doh! wrote:

> >>> Injun Ear wrote:
> >>>> Come on, guys, how bout giving him a straight answer. It's probably
> >>>> going through a defrost cycle. Your HVAC guy can adjust it so that

the

> >>>> heat strips kick in when it's in defrost so you don't feel so cold.
> >>> Thanks. I have tried putting the thing into emergency heat mode and I
> >>> find that this both gets heat coming from the registers but also gets
> >>> the aux heat indicator showing on the thermostat. So it seems that at
> >>> least part of the thermostat is ok and that the heater is working. But

> >>> am not sure what to conclude must be wrong here. Happy holidays!
> >> Most likely there's nothing at all wrong with your thermostat--but with

> >> trane / american standard then in order to get your electric strips to
> >> come
> >> on during condensor defrost you need to connect the black wire (

defrost

> >> signal ) at the condensing unit outside up to the aux heat terminal at
> >> the
> >> inside air handler--probably you'll find there is a spare white wire

that

> >> you can use for this.
> >> --

> > Thanks for your tip and happy holidays to you. Can you think of any
> > reason why this would have been working fine and suddenly stops working?
> > Perhaps it is in some way due to this very long and cold spell we have
> > had here in Seattle recently? I have to believe that this has been wired
> > correctly as I know I have seen the aux heat indicator come on the
> > thermostat before. I remember having to look it up in the thermostat
> > manual to find out what it means. Cheers!

> Thanks once again for your responses. I just found some info on the
> internet here

<http://en.allexperts.com/q/Heating-Air-Conditioning-696/2008/2/Heat-pump-th

ermostat-control.htm>
> and here

<http://en.allexperts.com/q/Heating-Air-Conditioning-696/2008/2/Heat-pump-th

ermostat-control.htm>
> that made me start checking things more carefully.
> When this cold spell hit, I raised the temperatures on my thermostat
> schedules. I have never done this before. Under the previous schedule, I
> had simply raised the temp manually on the thermostat to what I wanted
> when needed. Thinking back, this is when I typically saw the aux heat
> indicator show on the thermostat.
> So I just manually raised the temperature from its current setting by a
> couple degrees and indeed the thermostat does show the aux heat
> indicator. For this reason, I am thinking that the aux heater does, in
> fact, work.
> However, I am not sure about if it is working during the defrost cycle
> of the heat pump. I only found out recently that there was such a thing.
> I may never have noticed it before because it has never been this cold
> this long since I have been in this house with the heat pump. Maybe the
> heat pump only has to go through a defrost cycle when it is very cold.
> Or maybe it does it frequently but I have only noticed it now because
> the air being used right now is so very cold.

Yes defrost only happens when its fairly cold outside, and the colder it
gets outside the more noticable the cold air blast inside will be.

> Do I have to call in a pro to see it the thing is properly set/wired so
> that the aux heat comes on during the defrost cycle? Or is there some
> way I can check that?

Yes it would be a good idea to call in a pro, like I say it's the black wire
outside that needs to be traced /connected up to aux ( you will find voltage
there in relation to common only during defrost )--also suggest ask him
about a lockout thermostat, this is placed outdoors and can lower your
operating costs by locking out the electric strips unless the outdoors temps
drop below a set value say 40 deg or so.

As far as testing, its easy to test defrost operation--there's probably a
tst and speedup jumper wire or somesuch on the board but off the top of my
head I cant recall the exact configuration that trane / american standard
uses at this point in time.

> Thanks and happy holidays to all!

Posted by Bubba on December 25, 2008, 11:10 am

On Thu, 25 Dec 2008 07:32:41 -0800, David White

>David White wrote:

>> doh! wrote:

>>>> Injun Ear wrote:
>>>>> Come on, guys, how bout giving him a straight answer. It's probably
>>>>> going through a defrost cycle. Your HVAC guy can adjust it so that the
>>>>> heat strips kick in when it's in defrost so you don't feel so cold.
>>>> Thanks. I have tried putting the thing into emergency heat mode and I
>>>> find that this both gets heat coming from the registers but also gets
>>>> the aux heat indicator showing on the thermostat. So it seems that at
>>>> least part of the thermostat is ok and that the heater is working. But I
>>>> am not sure what to conclude must be wrong here. Happy holidays!
>>> Most likely there's nothing at all wrong with your thermostat--but with a
>>> trane / american standard then in order to get your electric strips to
>>> come
>>> on during condensor defrost you need to connect the black wire ( defrost
>>> signal ) at the condensing unit outside up to the aux heat terminal at
>>> the
>>> inside air handler--probably you'll find there is a spare white wire that
>>> you can use for this.
>>> --

>> Thanks for your tip and happy holidays to you. Can you think of any
>> reason why this would have been working fine and suddenly stops working?
>> Perhaps it is in some way due to this very long and cold spell we have
>> had here in Seattle recently? I have to believe that this has been wired
>> correctly as I know I have seen the aux heat indicator come on the
>> thermostat before. I remember having to look it up in the thermostat
>> manual to find out what it means. Cheers!

>Thanks once again for your responses. I just found some info on the
>internet here
>and here
>that made me start checking things more carefully.
>When this cold spell hit, I raised the temperatures on my thermostat
>schedules. I have never done this before. Under the previous schedule, I
>had simply raised the temp manually on the thermostat to what I wanted
>when needed. Thinking back, this is when I typically saw the aux heat
>indicator show on the thermostat.
>So I just manually raised the temperature from its current setting by a
>couple degrees and indeed the thermostat does show the aux heat
>indicator. For this reason, I am thinking that the aux heater does, in
>fact, work.
>However, I am not sure about if it is working during the defrost cycle
>of the heat pump. I only found out recently that there was such a thing.
>I may never have noticed it before because it has never been this cold
>this long since I have been in this house with the heat pump. Maybe the
>heat pump only has to go through a defrost cycle when it is very cold.
>Or maybe it does it frequently but I have only noticed it now because
>the air being used right now is so very cold.
>Do I have to call in a pro to see it the thing is properly set/wired so
>that the aux heat comes on during the defrost cycle? Or is there some
>way I can check that?
>Thanks and happy holidays to all!

Dude,
You need to do what you need to do. Anything could have happened or
nothing at all did. Remember, during defrost, the aux heat strips kick
in to "TEMPER" the air. Its not meant to heat the home at that time.
Watch the info you get from all the crack pots in here like "doh" and
others that want you to add a wire to something or others that think
we all owe you something and should answer your every question with a
smile. This group was mainly started with all professionals. In other
words, this is what we do to put food on our tables. If everyone
answered for free it wouldnt make a whole lot of sense for us. Take
what you get.
Merry Christmas

Posted by doh! on December 26, 2008, 7:53 pm

> On Thu, 25 Dec 2008 07:32:41 -0800, David White

> >David White wrote:

> >> doh! wrote:
> >>>> Injun Ear wrote:
> >>>>> Come on, guys, how bout giving him a straight answer. It's probably
> >>>>> going through a defrost cycle. Your HVAC guy can adjust it so that

the

> >>>>> heat strips kick in when it's in defrost so you don't feel so cold.
> >>>> Thanks. I have tried putting the thing into emergency heat mode and I
> >>>> find that this both gets heat coming from the registers but also gets
> >>>> the aux heat indicator showing on the thermostat. So it seems that at
> >>>> least part of the thermostat is ok and that the heater is working.

But I

> >>>> am not sure what to conclude must be wrong here. Happy holidays!
> >>> Most likely there's nothing at all wrong with your thermostat--but

with a

> >>> trane / american standard then in order to get your electric strips to
> >>> come
> >>> on during condensor defrost you need to connect the black wire (

defrost

> >>> signal ) at the condensing unit outside up to the aux heat terminal at
> >>> the
> >>> inside air handler--probably you'll find there is a spare white wire

that

> >>> you can use for this.
> >>> --
> >> Thanks for your tip and happy holidays to you. Can you think of any
> >> reason why this would have been working fine and suddenly stops

working?

> >> Perhaps it is in some way due to this very long and cold spell we have
> >> had here in Seattle recently? I have to believe that this has been

wired

> >> correctly as I know I have seen the aux heat indicator come on the
> >> thermostat before. I remember having to look it up in the thermostat
> >> manual to find out what it means. Cheers!

> >Thanks once again for your responses. I just found some info on the
> >internet here

><http://en.allexperts.com/q/Heating-Air-Conditioning-696/2008/2/Heat-pump-t
hermostat-control.htm>

> >and here

><http://en.allexperts.com/q/Heating-Air-Conditioning-696/2008/2/Heat-pump-t
hermostat-control.htm>

> >that made me start checking things more carefully.
> >When this cold spell hit, I raised the temperatures on my thermostat
> >schedules. I have never done this before. Under the previous schedule, I
> >had simply raised the temp manually on the thermostat to what I wanted
> >when needed. Thinking back, this is when I typically saw the aux heat
> >indicator show on the thermostat.
> >So I just manually raised the temperature from its current setting by a
> >couple degrees and indeed the thermostat does show the aux heat
> >indicator. For this reason, I am thinking that the aux heater does, in
> >fact, work.
> >However, I am not sure about if it is working during the defrost cycle
> >of the heat pump. I only found out recently that there was such a thing.
> >I may never have noticed it before because it has never been this cold
> >this long since I have been in this house with the heat pump. Maybe the
> >heat pump only has to go through a defrost cycle when it is very cold.
> >Or maybe it does it frequently but I have only noticed it now because
> >the air being used right now is so very cold.
> >Do I have to call in a pro to see it the thing is properly set/wired so
> >that the aux heat comes on during the defrost cycle? Or is there some
> >way I can check that?
> >Thanks and happy holidays to all!

> Dude,
> You need to do what you need to do. Anything could have happened or
> nothing at all did. Remember, during defrost, the aux heat strips kick
> in to "TEMPER" the air. Its not meant to heat the home at that time.

Well no shit dude glad to see that maybe you finally learning to keep up.

> Watch the info you get from all the crack pots in here like "doh" and
> others that want you to add a wire to something or others

Go fuck yourself most likely you don't encounter a heat pump with electric
strips
more often that perhaps 3 times per decade.

--Pretty sure it was you about 2 years back that was trying to tell us all
about how best to add an outdoors thermostat so as to shut the heat pump
clear off and go to aux only during cold spells but hey now it's not worth
my time looking it up.

--

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Heat Pump + Aux Heat Problem - Can You Help? - Page 2