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New Trane system rumbles on startup/shutdown, and other issues

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New Trane system rumbles on startup/shutdown, and other issues Jason 12-12-2006
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Posted by on December 12, 2006, 8:55 pm
"Noon-Air" wrote:

>
>>
>>> first off, turn on the intelligent recovery feature on the thermostat,
>>> and
>>> give it a couple of weeks to learn when to turn on the system to be at
>>> the
>>> desired temp at the desired time like it was designed to. with this
>>> feature,
>>> it will try to use the *primary* part of the system(the heat pump) to
>>> bring
>>> the temp up to your comfort level, then only use the furnace if the temp
>>> is
>>> not at the set point at the desired time. Only one or the other should
>>> run
>>> at any given time *NOT* both.
>>> Your installer should have explained all this to you.
>>>
>>> Set the thermostat, and let it do its job.
>>>
>>> BTW... short recovery time = higher energy usage and higher bills.
>>
>> I did have the intelligent thing on for awhile thinking it might be
>> better. The installers said they always turn it OFF in every install.
>> The heat pump started coming on earlier and earlier. When it came on
>> at 3:30am and still couldn't heat the house to 70 by 7am, I turned it
>> off, opting for gas heat to heat up the house quicker.
>
>Your installers are idiots
>How cold was it outside and what was the temp inside when it came on at
>3:30?? What is your setback temp??
>
>Last week when it was in the teens here in south Mississippi, my heat was
>coming on at 3:30 too... Today it didn't come on until 6:05 because it was
>58 degrees last night.... and yes I DO use the intellegent recovery feature
>on my stat.... it saves me as much as 18% on my utility bills.
>


I sure would like to know the formula you use to calculate this 18%.

About the only realistic way I can think of is to have an identical
setup running in parallel to your existing, and then chart the
differences each and every day.

Sure, if you said you saved 18% over last year, month etc, but even at
that there's no weather data or setpoint comparisons.

IMO, any supposed 'savings' is nothing but marketing hype, as there's
absolutely no way to verify any savings or not, at least not until you
have identical equipment conditioning identical structures in
identical conditions. Then and only then will you have an accurate
comparison model to guage any 'savings'.

Posted by Noon-Air on December 12, 2006, 9:31 pm

> "Noon-Air" wrote:
>
>>
>>>
>>>> first off, turn on the intelligent recovery feature on the thermostat,
>>>> and
>>>> give it a couple of weeks to learn when to turn on the system to be at
>>>> the
>>>> desired temp at the desired time like it was designed to. with this
>>>> feature,
>>>> it will try to use the *primary* part of the system(the heat pump) to
>>>> bring
>>>> the temp up to your comfort level, then only use the furnace if the
>>>> temp
>>>> is
>>>> not at the set point at the desired time. Only one or the other should
>>>> run
>>>> at any given time *NOT* both.
>>>> Your installer should have explained all this to you.
>>>>
>>>> Set the thermostat, and let it do its job.
>>>>
>>>> BTW... short recovery time = higher energy usage and higher bills.
>>>
>>> I did have the intelligent thing on for awhile thinking it might be
>>> better. The installers said they always turn it OFF in every install.
>>> The heat pump started coming on earlier and earlier. When it came on
>>> at 3:30am and still couldn't heat the house to 70 by 7am, I turned it
>>> off, opting for gas heat to heat up the house quicker.
>>
>>Your installers are idiots
>>How cold was it outside and what was the temp inside when it came on at
>>3:30?? What is your setback temp??
>>
>>Last week when it was in the teens here in south Mississippi, my heat was
>>coming on at 3:30 too... Today it didn't come on until 6:05 because it was
>>58 degrees last night.... and yes I DO use the intellegent recovery
>>feature
>>on my stat.... it saves me as much as 18% on my utility bills.
>>
>
>
> I sure would like to know the formula you use to calculate this 18%.
>
> About the only realistic way I can think of is to have an identical
> setup running in parallel to your existing, and then chart the
> differences each and every day.
>
> Sure, if you said you saved 18% over last year, month etc, but even at
> that there's no weather data or setpoint comparisons.
>
> IMO, any supposed 'savings' is nothing but marketing hype, as there's
> absolutely no way to verify any savings or not, at least not until you
> have identical equipment conditioning identical structures in
> identical conditions. Then and only then will you have an accurate
> comparison model to guage any 'savings'.

I compared my own utility bills and actual energy usage over a 5 year time
period.



Posted by Jeffrey Lebowski on December 12, 2006, 10:02 pm

>

> >>
> >>on my stat.... it saves me as much as 18% on my utility bills.
> >>
> >
> >
> > I sure would like to know the formula you use to calculate this 18%.
> >
> > About the only realistic way I can think of is to have an identical
> > setup running in parallel to your existing, and then chart the
> > differences each and every day.
> >
> > Sure, if you said you saved 18% over last year, month etc, but even at
> > that there's no weather data or setpoint comparisons.
> >
> > IMO, any supposed 'savings' is nothing but marketing hype, as there's
> > absolutely no way to verify any savings or not, at least not until you
> > have identical equipment conditioning identical structures in
> > identical conditions. Then and only then will you have an accurate
> > comparison model to guage any 'savings'.
>
> I compared my own utility bills and actual energy usage over a 5 year time
> period.
>

Shut off all of the heat strips here as of Nov of last year, added a second
( open loop wshp ) heat pump as aux instead--looking like probly will be
coming in close to a 50% savings over last year.

Really love that intelligent recovery....currently running the
ChronothermIII units at the shop and in the residence--and when I eventually
get around to adding dampers and zoning the house then will probably use
them there, too.

--

SVL






Posted by on December 13, 2006, 11:09 am

>
>> "Noon-Air" wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> first off, turn on the intelligent recovery feature on the thermostat,
>>>>> and
>>>>> give it a couple of weeks to learn when to turn on the system to be at
>>>>> the
>>>>> desired temp at the desired time like it was designed to. with this
>>>>> feature,
>>>>> it will try to use the *primary* part of the system(the heat pump) to
>>>>> bring
>>>>> the temp up to your comfort level, then only use the furnace if the
>>>>> temp
>>>>> is
>>>>> not at the set point at the desired time. Only one or the other should
>>>>> run
>>>>> at any given time *NOT* both.
>>>>> Your installer should have explained all this to you.
>>>>>
>>>>> Set the thermostat, and let it do its job.
>>>>>
>>>>> BTW... short recovery time = higher energy usage and higher bills.
>>>>
>>>> I did have the intelligent thing on for awhile thinking it might be
>>>> better. The installers said they always turn it OFF in every install.
>>>> The heat pump started coming on earlier and earlier. When it came on
>>>> at 3:30am and still couldn't heat the house to 70 by 7am, I turned it
>>>> off, opting for gas heat to heat up the house quicker.
>>>
>>>Your installers are idiots
>>>How cold was it outside and what was the temp inside when it came on at
>>>3:30?? What is your setback temp??
>>>
>>>Last week when it was in the teens here in south Mississippi, my heat was
>>>coming on at 3:30 too... Today it didn't come on until 6:05 because it was
>>>58 degrees last night.... and yes I DO use the intellegent recovery
>>>feature
>>>on my stat.... it saves me as much as 18% on my utility bills.
>>>
>>
>>
>> I sure would like to know the formula you use to calculate this 18%.
>>
>> About the only realistic way I can think of is to have an identical
>> setup running in parallel to your existing, and then chart the
>> differences each and every day.
>>
>> Sure, if you said you saved 18% over last year, month etc, but even at
>> that there's no weather data or setpoint comparisons.
>>
>> IMO, any supposed 'savings' is nothing but marketing hype, as there's
>> absolutely no way to verify any savings or not, at least not until you
>> have identical equipment conditioning identical structures in
>> identical conditions. Then and only then will you have an accurate
>> comparison model to guage any 'savings'.
>
>I compared my own utility bills and actual energy usage over a 5 year time
>period.
>

no shit?

since all related factors remained exactly the same, ie programming
setpoints, occupancy, yearly weather data, utility rates yada yada,
you can definitively say you've realized an 18% energy savings based
solely on adaptive intelligent recovery?

have you considered being a politician as a second career? :)

Posted by Noon-Air on December 13, 2006, 11:24 am

>
>>
>>> "Noon-Air" wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> first off, turn on the intelligent recovery feature on the
>>>>>> thermostat,
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> give it a couple of weeks to learn when to turn on the system to be
>>>>>> at
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> desired temp at the desired time like it was designed to. with this
>>>>>> feature,
>>>>>> it will try to use the *primary* part of the system(the heat pump)
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> bring
>>>>>> the temp up to your comfort level, then only use the furnace if the
>>>>>> temp
>>>>>> is
>>>>>> not at the set point at the desired time. Only one or the other
>>>>>> should
>>>>>> run
>>>>>> at any given time *NOT* both.
>>>>>> Your installer should have explained all this to you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Set the thermostat, and let it do its job.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> BTW... short recovery time = higher energy usage and higher bills.
>>>>>
>>>>> I did have the intelligent thing on for awhile thinking it might be
>>>>> better. The installers said they always turn it OFF in every install.
>>>>> The heat pump started coming on earlier and earlier. When it came on
>>>>> at 3:30am and still couldn't heat the house to 70 by 7am, I turned it
>>>>> off, opting for gas heat to heat up the house quicker.
>>>>
>>>>Your installers are idiots
>>>>How cold was it outside and what was the temp inside when it came on at
>>>>3:30?? What is your setback temp??
>>>>
>>>>Last week when it was in the teens here in south Mississippi, my heat
>>>>was
>>>>coming on at 3:30 too... Today it didn't come on until 6:05 because it
>>>>was
>>>>58 degrees last night.... and yes I DO use the intellegent recovery
>>>>feature
>>>>on my stat.... it saves me as much as 18% on my utility bills.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I sure would like to know the formula you use to calculate this 18%.
>>>
>>> About the only realistic way I can think of is to have an identical
>>> setup running in parallel to your existing, and then chart the
>>> differences each and every day.
>>>
>>> Sure, if you said you saved 18% over last year, month etc, but even at
>>> that there's no weather data or setpoint comparisons.
>>>
>>> IMO, any supposed 'savings' is nothing but marketing hype, as there's
>>> absolutely no way to verify any savings or not, at least not until you
>>> have identical equipment conditioning identical structures in
>>> identical conditions. Then and only then will you have an accurate
>>> comparison model to guage any 'savings'.
>>
>>I compared my own utility bills and actual energy usage over a 5 year time
>>period.
>>
>
> no shit?
>
> since all related factors remained exactly the same, ie programming
> setpoints, occupancy, yearly weather data, utility rates yada yada,
> you can definitively say you've realized an 18% energy savings based
> solely on adaptive intelligent recovery?

based on the first 4 years in this home without a smart stat(it had a
Honeywell, mechanical, auto change-over stat), and tracking the energy
prices, KWH and Therms used, with proper maintenance on the system and no
other changes in the system configuration, then 5 years with the addition of
a Chronotherm III stat, still tracking energy prices, and the KWH and Therms
used by the same system, has resulted in an *AVERAGE* energy usage reduction
in my home of 18%.
You want to see all the bills??

BTW... I currently am using a VisionPro 8000 stat, but only because I wanted
a new toy.

> have you considered being a politician as a second career? :)

no thanx, I have no desire for the required lobotomy.



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