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Posted by Steve on February 25, 2009, 10:57 pm
> wrote:
>>Steve wrote:
>>>Steve wrote:
>>>wrote:
>>>The extra cost at this time would be about $200 for valves and hard
>>>start capacitor.
>>>Two hundred bucks? I'd be on that faster than a scalded dog.
>>>That's not a standalone price. I still have to pay for purging and
>>>recharging with a bit extra for brazing fittings. This would be viable
>>>only if the other stuff becomes necessary.
>>>So far, it doesn't look like you got such a great deal on the Goodman
>>>equipment. For everything else you have spent, and what your fixin to
>>>spend,
>>>you could have gotten a lot better quality equipment that already has
>>>expansion valves, hard start kit already installed, and had the whole job
>>>done with no problems, and a full warranty.
>>>But it seems that your bent on re-inventing the wheel, and throwing a
>>>whole
>>>lot of good money after bad....but its your money, you can do what you
>>>want
>>>with it.
>>>He could have bought Goodman equipment with a TXV & with a Copeland
>>>Scroll
>>>compressor,
>>>with a Scroll usually no start-kit is required; I wouldn't have any
>>>system
>>>any other way. - udarrell
>>>FWIW, most all Rheem 410a equipment...especially heat pumps come from the
>>>factory with hard start kits installed. I am assuming that they do this
>>>for
>>>a reason..
>>I agree with your point Steve; though A/C's with R-22 seem to start
>>easily without a start kit.
>>Even with a Scroll compressor, a start kit is a good idea for heat pumps
>>using 410a.
> A start kit on a scroll?? Come on Darrell.
He's right.....
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Posted by Bubba on February 26, 2009, 6:41 pm
wrote:
>> wrote:
>>>Steve wrote:
>>>>Steve wrote:
>>>>wrote:
>>>>The extra cost at this time would be about $200 for valves and hard
>>>>start capacitor.
>>>>Two hundred bucks? I'd be on that faster than a scalded dog.
>>>>That's not a standalone price. I still have to pay for purging and
>>>>recharging with a bit extra for brazing fittings. This would be viable
>>>>only if the other stuff becomes necessary.
>>>>So far, it doesn't look like you got such a great deal on the Goodman
>>>>equipment. For everything else you have spent, and what your fixin to
>>>>spend,
>>>>you could have gotten a lot better quality equipment that already has
>>>>expansion valves, hard start kit already installed, and had the whole job
>>>>done with no problems, and a full warranty.
>>>>But it seems that your bent on re-inventing the wheel, and throwing a
>>>>whole
>>>>lot of good money after bad....but its your money, you can do what you
>>>>want
>>>>with it.
>>>>He could have bought Goodman equipment with a TXV & with a Copeland
>>>>Scroll
>>>>compressor,
>>>>with a Scroll usually no start-kit is required; I wouldn't have any
>>>>system
>>>>any other way. - udarrell
>>>>FWIW, most all Rheem 410a equipment...especially heat pumps come from the
>>>>factory with hard start kits installed. I am assuming that they do this
>>>>for
>>>>a reason..
>>>I agree with your point Steve; though A/C's with R-22 seem to start
>>>easily without a start kit.
>>>Even with a Scroll compressor, a start kit is a good idea for heat pumps
>>>using 410a.
>> A start kit on a scroll?? Come on Darrell.
>He's right.....
Ok, so are we talking about one of those 2 wire clip on ones or are
you talking about a real start kit with a start capacitor and
potential relay? Even still, I havent seen any scrolls with them but I
can manage a real start kit over those clip ons that do nothing but
melt and make a mess in the control panel.
Bubba
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Posted by Jean on February 26, 2009, 7:04 pm
wrote:
>wrote:
>>> wrote:
>>>>Steve wrote:
>>>>>Steve wrote:
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>The extra cost at this time would be about $200 for valves and hard
>>>>>start capacitor.
>>>>>Two hundred bucks? I'd be on that faster than a scalded dog.
>>>>>That's not a standalone price. I still have to pay for purging and
>>>>>recharging with a bit extra for brazing fittings. This would be viable
>>>>>only if the other stuff becomes necessary.
>>>>>So far, it doesn't look like you got such a great deal on the Goodman
>>>>>equipment. For everything else you have spent, and what your fixin to
>>>>>spend,
>>>>>you could have gotten a lot better quality equipment that already has
>>>>>expansion valves, hard start kit already installed, and had the whole job
>>>>>done with no problems, and a full warranty.
>>>>>But it seems that your bent on re-inventing the wheel, and throwing a
>>>>>whole
>>>>>lot of good money after bad....but its your money, you can do what you
>>>>>want
>>>>>with it.
>>>>>He could have bought Goodman equipment with a TXV & with a Copeland
>>>>>Scroll
>>>>>compressor,
>>>>>with a Scroll usually no start-kit is required; I wouldn't have any
>>>>>system
>>>>>any other way. - udarrell
>>>>>FWIW, most all Rheem 410a equipment...especially heat pumps come from the
>>>>>factory with hard start kits installed. I am assuming that they do this
>>>>>for
>>>>>a reason..
>>>>I agree with your point Steve; though A/C's with R-22 seem to start
>>>>easily without a start kit.
>>>>Even with a Scroll compressor, a start kit is a good idea for heat pumps
>>>>using 410a.
>>> A start kit on a scroll?? Come on Darrell.
>>He's right.....
>Ok, so are we talking about one of those 2 wire clip on ones or are
>you talking about a real start kit with a start capacitor and
>potential relay? Even still, I havent seen any scrolls with them but I
>can manage a real start kit over those clip ons that do nothing but
>melt and make a mess in the control panel.
>Bubba
The Kickstart(tm) has a real potential relay built in.
http://www.kickstartoem.com/faqs/distributor.html
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Posted by Steve on February 26, 2009, 9:17 pm
>>Ok, so are we talking about one of those 2 wire clip on ones or are
>>you talking about a real start kit with a start capacitor and
>>potential relay? Even still, I havent seen any scrolls with them but I
>>can manage a real start kit over those clip ons that do nothing but
>>melt and make a mess in the control panel.
>>Bubba
> The Kickstart(tm) has a real potential relay built in.
> http://www.kickstartoem.com/faqs/distributor.html
I carry a couple of those on the truck, but all of the systems I am
installing come out of the box with a start cap and a potential relay.
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Posted by Don Ocean on February 26, 2009, 10:57 pm
Jean wrote:
> wrote:
>
>> wrote:
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Steve wrote:
>>>>>> Steve wrote:
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> The extra cost at this time would be about $200 for valves and hard
>>>>>> start capacitor.
>>>>>> Two hundred bucks? I'd be on that faster than a scalded dog.
>>>>>> That's not a standalone price. I still have to pay for purging and
>>>>>> recharging with a bit extra for brazing fittings. This would be viable
>>>>>> only if the other stuff becomes necessary.
>>>>>> So far, it doesn't look like you got such a great deal on the Goodman
>>>>>> equipment. For everything else you have spent, and what your fixin to
>>>>>> spend,
>>>>>> you could have gotten a lot better quality equipment that already has
>>>>>> expansion valves, hard start kit already installed, and had the whole job
>>>>>> done with no problems, and a full warranty.
>>>>>> But it seems that your bent on re-inventing the wheel, and throwing a
>>>>>> whole
>>>>>> lot of good money after bad....but its your money, you can do what you
>>>>>> want
>>>>>> with it.
>>>>>> He could have bought Goodman equipment with a TXV & with a Copeland
>>>>>> Scroll
>>>>>> compressor,
>>>>>> with a Scroll usually no start-kit is required; I wouldn't have any
>>>>>> system
>>>>>> any other way. - udarrell
>>>>>> FWIW, most all Rheem 410a equipment...especially heat pumps come from the
>>>>>> factory with hard start kits installed. I am assuming that they do this
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> a reason..
>>>>> I agree with your point Steve; though A/C's with R-22 seem to start
>>>>> easily without a start kit.
>>>>> Even with a Scroll compressor, a start kit is a good idea for heat pumps
>>>>> using 410a.
>>>> A start kit on a scroll?? Come on Darrell.
>>> He's right.....
>> Ok, so are we talking about one of those 2 wire clip on ones or are
>> you talking about a real start kit with a start capacitor and
>> potential relay? Even still, I havent seen any scrolls with them but I
>> can manage a real start kit over those clip ons that do nothing but
>> melt and make a mess in the control panel.
>> Bubba
>
> The Kickstart(tm) has a real potential relay built in.
>
> http://www.kickstartoem.com/faqs/distributor.html
you can argue about this forever, but there is no reason on earth that
a properly designed system should ever need a hard start relay added. If
you have this problem, then it is the time to demand answers from the
manufacturers. They are now liable for lots of product liability. If the
compressor needs to start under a normally heavy load, then the
compressor start winding should be heftier in design. If enough of you
folks dump this back into the laps of the manufacturers, this problem
will be addressed and resolved by them. After all, it is their
responsibility.
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