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heat pump thermostat question ONJ 12-03-2007
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Posted by Bubba on December 4, 2007, 5:18 pm

>>
>>>
>>> >>
>>> >>>I bought a house that has a newly installed Trane air heat pump and an
>>> >>>electric furnace emergency backup.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> As far as I'm concerned I don't want the HVAC company that installed
>> it
>>> >>> to look at it as they want to charge me for an incompetent setup.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The way its set up is the heat pump runs whenever the stat is calling
>> for
>>> >>> heat...even down below temps in the teens and colder when the heat
>> pump
>>> >>> is obviously useless...it still runs along with the electric furnace.
>>> >>> This is a horrible waste of electricity and I figure is costing me
>> about
>>> >>> 30% more on my electric bill when the outside temp is that cold.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Anyone know of a thermostat that I can install that is inexpensive as
>>> >>> possible that will lock the heat pump out when the electric furnace
>> kicks
>>> >>> on? Or one that I can install an outside sensor and the heat pump
>> kicks
>>> >>> off at a certain temp and tells the backup to run?
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Thanks
>>> >>
>>> >> You got 3 choices... you can call the installer to come out and
>>> >> correct
>>> >> any problems, or you can call a competent, licensed HVAC tech to come
>> out
>>> >> and correct any problems, or you can live with it.
>>> >
>>> >Or I can get a proper thermostat and outdoor sensor and do it myself.
>> Its
>>> >not that hard, just didn't know which thermostat to use or what is
>>> >available.
>>> >
>>> >dont HVAC techs just hate it when normal people can do what they can do?
>>> >Must really suck.
>>> >
>>>
>>> Clueless sum-biatch, aint cha.
>>> As Noon said, read the performance charts you clueless ass-wipe.
>>> Bubba
>>
>> Actually I doubt Noon has ever had to actually understand and apply heat
>> pump heating performance charts.
>
>Not only that, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that heat
>pump performance charts don't mean a thing if the heat pump is no longer
>able to bring the indoor temperature up to satisfy the thermostat.
>
>So if a heat pump is running and instead of the indoor temp going up...it
>goes down...its a waste of electricity for it to run from that point on.
>Its called common sense which a few of the so-called HVAC techs seem to
>lack.
>
>Mind you, I'm not talking about the credible techs with real
>knowledge...just a few hacks that have no business being in the
>business...like p.jm, Bubba and Noon-Air
>
So using your logic (hehehe).............
Id stack two boxes of rocks side by side and still say,
"You are dumber than two boxes of rocks".
How sad it must be to be that fuquering dumb.
Bubba

Posted by Noon-Air on December 4, 2007, 10:21 pm

>>
>>>
>>> >>
>>> >>>I bought a house that has a newly installed Trane air heat pump and
>>> >>>an
>>> >>>electric furnace emergency backup.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> As far as I'm concerned I don't want the HVAC company that installed
>> it
>>> >>> to look at it as they want to charge me for an incompetent setup.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> The way its set up is the heat pump runs whenever the stat is
>>> >>> calling
>> for
>>> >>> heat...even down below temps in the teens and colder when the heat
>> pump
>>> >>> is obviously useless...it still runs along with the electric
>>> >>> furnace.
>>> >>> This is a horrible waste of electricity and I figure is costing me
>> about
>>> >>> 30% more on my electric bill when the outside temp is that cold.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Anyone know of a thermostat that I can install that is inexpensive
>>> >>> as
>>> >>> possible that will lock the heat pump out when the electric furnace
>> kicks
>>> >>> on? Or one that I can install an outside sensor and the heat pump
>> kicks
>>> >>> off at a certain temp and tells the backup to run?
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Thanks
>>> >>
>>> >> You got 3 choices... you can call the installer to come out and
>>> >> correct
>>> >> any problems, or you can call a competent, licensed HVAC tech to come
>> out
>>> >> and correct any problems, or you can live with it.
>>> >
>>> >Or I can get a proper thermostat and outdoor sensor and do it myself.
>> Its
>>> >not that hard, just didn't know which thermostat to use or what is
>>> >available.
>>> >
>>> >dont HVAC techs just hate it when normal people can do what they can
>>> >do?
>>> >Must really suck.
>>> >
>>>
>>> Clueless sum-biatch, aint cha.
>>> As Noon said, read the performance charts you clueless ass-wipe.
>>> Bubba
>>
>> Actually I doubt Noon has ever had to actually understand and apply heat
>> pump heating performance charts.

Actually I *DO* understand and use performance charts routinely, TYVM. I use
them every time I design a system for one of my customers, as I did again
this afternoon.

> Not only that, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that heat
> pump performance charts don't mean a thing if the heat pump is no longer
> able to bring the indoor temperature up to satisfy the thermostat.

The temperature doesn't have to go *up* for a heat pump to be
working....even if its putting out enough heat to partially offset the total
heat loss of the structure, its still working. The strips are just there to
*AUGMENT* the heat pump when its not keeping up.
Heat pumps at 17F will normally make better than 50% of their total rated
heat capacity at 47F.
If the heat pump is not correctly installed and the refrigerant charge
properly balanced, all bets are off.

> So if a heat pump is running and instead of the indoor temp going up...it
> goes down...its a waste of electricity for it to run from that point on.

Not even close.

> Its called common sense which a few of the so-called HVAC techs seem to
> lack.

What lacks common sense is to make all your wild claims without posting your
location, the actual results of the Manual J heat load/loss calculations,
the actual air balance results, and make/model/serial numbers of the heat
pump, and air handler. Without this minimum information, *NOBODY* can give
you any difinitive answers.

> Mind you, I'm not talking about the credible techs with real
> knowledge...just a few hacks that have no business being in the
> business...like p.jm, Bubba and Noon-Air

Say what you will... but until you actually come and see any of us and
witness what we do and how we do it, then you have no basis for your claims.

*Most* of us have been certified master techs for 10 years or more. Thats
not something that they give away like they do computer science and liberal
arts degrees.



Posted by on December 4, 2007, 10:31 pm
wrote:

>*Most* of us have been certified master techs for 10 years or more. Thats
>not something that they give away like they do computer science and liberal
>arts degrees.

        Hey, now ! :-(

        Oh, wait, I never did get a CS degree ( although I did do some
TEACHING for them, once upon a time ) - and they ARE fucking
worthless.

        LA degrees are, of course utterly worthless in all cases :-)

        OK, carry on :-)



--
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http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
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Posted by Simon Schnizzard on December 5, 2007, 9:28 pm

> >
> > Actually I doubt Noon has ever had to actually understand and apply heat
> > pump heating performance charts.
>
>
> Mind you, I'm not talking about the credible techs with real
> knowledge...just a few hacks that have no business being in the
> business...like p.jm, Bubba and Noon-Air
>

Hey shithead appears you sure can read between the lines and stretch things
when it suits your agenda.

All of the above including Noon have a high level of technical expertise,
just that Noon happens to live in an area where heat pumps rarely if ever
even go into defrost mode.

--





Posted by on December 5, 2007, 9:36 pm
On Wed, 5 Dec 2007 18:28:56 -0800, "Simon Schnizzard"

>
>> >
>> > Actually I doubt Noon has ever had to actually understand and apply heat
>> > pump heating performance charts.
>>
>>
>> Mind you, I'm not talking about the credible techs with real
>> knowledge...just a few hacks that have no business being in the
>> business...like p.jm, Bubba and Noon-Air
>>
>
>Hey shithead appears you sure can read between the lines and stretch things
>when it suits your agenda.
>
>All of the above including Noon have a high level of technical expertise,
>just that Noon happens to live in an area where heat pumps rarely if ever
>even go into defrost mode.

        I bet Stormy could help him out ....


--
Click here every day to feed an animal that needs you today !!!
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/

Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
'Some days, it's just not worth chewing through the restraints.'
'With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine.'
HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's
Free demo now available online http://pmilligan.net/palm/

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