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8-gauge low voltage wire

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8-gauge low voltage wire dchou4u@hotmail.com 05-03-2008
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Posted by Ralph Mowery on May 4, 2008, 5:13 pm

>
>> Hi, I am thinking of buying a spool of 8 gauge low voltage wires to
>> use with my Malibu 600W transformer for my yard. Will the 8 gauge
>> wires be too hard to deploy since they are so thick? Also will the
>> cable connectors that come with the Malibu light fixtures be able to
>> clamp around the wire and penetrate the sheathing?
>>
>> I am using 12 gauge at this time, but the lights are pretty dimmer
>> since the total length is about 70'.
>
> What about running 2 transformers in parallel. Might be less labor than
> digging up 70ft of wire. If you happen to have access to a second
> transformer it wouldn't hurt to try.
>
> I gave up on those low voltage garden lights a long time ago. It seems
> like the ones sold in kits (Toro, Malibu) from HD, Lowes and etc
> are so cheaply made it's impossible to keep them going very long.
> RM~

YOu can not parallel 2 transformers to help in this case. The problem with
low voltage wiring is there is too much voltage drop along the wires unless
very large wire is used.



Posted by Boden on May 4, 2008, 5:01 pm
Ralph Mowery wrote:

>
>>
>>>Hi, I am thinking of buying a spool of 8 gauge low voltage wires to
>>>use with my Malibu 600W transformer for my yard. Will the 8 gauge
>>>wires be too hard to deploy since they are so thick? Also will the
>>>cable connectors that come with the Malibu light fixtures be able to
>>>clamp around the wire and penetrate the sheathing?
>>>
>>>I am using 12 gauge at this time, but the lights are pretty dimmer
>>>since the total length is about 70'.
>>
>>What about running 2 transformers in parallel. Might be less labor than
>>digging up 70ft of wire. If you happen to have access to a second
>>transformer it wouldn't hurt to try.
>>
>>I gave up on those low voltage garden lights a long time ago. It seems
>>like the ones sold in kits (Toro, Malibu) from HD, Lowes and etc
>>are so cheaply made it's impossible to keep them going very long.
>>RM~
>
>
> YOu can not parallel 2 transformers to help in this case. The problem with
> low voltage wiring is there is too much voltage drop along the wires unless
> very large wire is used.
>
>
While you shouldn't parallel two transformers if replacing wire is a
Herculean task it would be possible to place a rectifier on each
transformer secondary, and build a fairly simple active device that will
sum the currents from each source to accomplish a the same thing as
paralleling the transformers, The only difference is that the lamps
would be supplied with dc instead of ac.

Small voltage variations (as are caused by the voltage drop in the wire)
will cause quite noticeable changes in perceived brightness. Around its
normal operating point a 0.25 volt difference for a 12 v lamp will
result in an 8% change in brightness. If the voltage drop increases to
0.5 volts, the brightness change is 16%. Further, as the voltage
drops the temperature also drops and the color will shift further to the
longer (more yellow) wavelengths.

Posted by David Nebenzahl on May 4, 2008, 10:09 pm
On 5/4/2008 2:01 PM Boden spake thus:

> Ralph Mowery wrote:
>
>> YOu can not parallel 2 transformers to help in this case. The problem with
>> low voltage wiring is there is too much voltage drop along the wires unless
>> very large wire is used.
>
> While you shouldn't parallel two transformers if replacing wire is a
> Herculean task it would be possible to place a rectifier on each
> transformer secondary, and build a fairly simple active device that will
> sum the currents from each source to accomplish a the same thing as
> paralleling the transformers, The only difference is that the lamps
> would be supplied with dc instead of ac.

You can actually "parallel" (god, that use of a noun as a verb just
grates on my ears; I must really be old school; should read "run in
parallel") two transformers without any of that stuff you mentioned,
assuming they're nearly identical in size. You just need to make sure
they're in phase, which is pretty easy to determine with an ordinary
voltmeter.

But it isn't a recommended practice, and there are other, better solutions.


--
The best argument against democracy is a five-minute
conversation with the average voter.

- Attributed to Winston Churchill

Posted by Ralph Mowery on May 4, 2008, 11:29 pm

> On 5/4/2008 2:01 PM Boden spake thus:
>
>> Ralph Mowery wrote:
>>
>>> YOu can not parallel 2 transformers to help in this case. The problem
>>> with low voltage wiring is there is too much voltage drop along the
>>> wires unless very large wire is used.
>>
>> While you shouldn't parallel two transformers if replacing wire is a
>> Herculean task it would be possible to place a rectifier on each
>> transformer secondary, and build a fairly simple active device that will
>> sum the currents from each source to accomplish a the same thing as
>> paralleling the transformers, The only difference is that the lamps
>> would be supplied with dc instead of ac.
>
> You can actually "parallel" (god, that use of a noun as a verb just grates
> on my ears; I must really be old school; should read "run in parallel")
> two transformers without any of that stuff you mentioned, assuming they're
> nearly identical in size. You just need to make sure they're in phase,
> which is pretty easy to determine with an ordinary voltmeter.
>
> But it isn't a recommended practice, and there are other, better
> solutions.
>

Yes, two transformers can be put in parallel. That will not help the
origional problem. Without going to some exotic circuits, there is nothing
that can be done without installing very large wire or rearanging the way
the bulbs are wired.

If another similar transformer is put at the far end of the run of lights it
may help out on the problem. This will put the transformers in parallel
with a long run of wire between them. The lights on each end will be about
full brightness and the ones toward the middle will be the dimmest.



Posted by Mark Lloyd on May 5, 2008, 10:37 am
On Sun, 4 May 2008 22:29:30 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"

[snip]

>
>Yes, two transformers can be put in parallel.

And you have to be sure you get the phase correct or you get a short
circuit.

> That will not help the
>origional problem. Without going to some exotic circuits, there is nothing
>that can be done without installing very large wire or rearanging the way
>the bulbs are wired.
>
>If another similar transformer is put at the far end of the run of lights it
>may help out on the problem. This will put the transformers in parallel
>with a long run of wire between them. The lights on each end will be about
>full brightness and the ones toward the middle will be the dimmest.
>
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Unlike biological evolution. 'intelligent design' is
not a genuine scientific theory and, therefore, has
no place in the curriculum of our nation's public
school classes." -- Ted Kennedy

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