CLEAR hardwood finishes? -- moisture cure, etc. - Page 6

>> With clear finish, oak generally is a mid-tone to deep brown, even
>> without any stain. And it is very "grainy".
>
> Maybe that's the problem. I was hoping to be able to apply a completely
> clear finish and have it look pretty much the way it looks now
> unfinished, but with a clear finsih on top. I guess that won't happen.
>
> In my original post, I was also asking about clear Moisture Cure
> Urethane. The impression I got is that when it goes on it doesn't really
> change the color or look of the wood. I think they said that is what is
> used on bowling alleys. I don't know if all of that is true, but it
> doesn't matter anyway because I can't find any places to buy the stuff
> other than online.
>
>> It might help if you upload some pix and post a link, at least for the
>> areas you consider problems. A good way to get a close idea of how
>> wood will look with a clear finish is to simply wet it with solvent.
>> Any chance you can replace some of the worst looking boards?
>
> Replacing boards won't be a realsitic option at this point. And, I
> don't think I'll get to do the picture idea. Since today is Saturday, I
> need to figure out something and get this done this weekend.
>
> I have a hunch that what I am going to end up doing is picking one of
> the stains that I already tested and go with that. The stains all
> darken and even out the color variations, and some of them look okay
> enough to go with (I'm leaning toward Colonial Maple or Golden Pecan).
> Maybe it won't be exactly what I was hoping for -- just a clear finish
> over the unfinished wood -- but it will be done.
>
>> I took a look at the link you provided and went to the product...RO22
>> is called "rustic", as opposed to other red oak called "select" and
>> some called "natural". If some of the wood is much harder, accounting
>> for the very light look, you can blend them using stain if you apply
>> the stain and don't wipe it off the light spots. I haven't done
>> flooring, but lots of furniture, and have mixed my own stains. If you
>> apply half-strength stain to the entire floor, you can help blend very
>> light spots by brushing on same stain, full-strength and not wiping it
>> off. Sort of a half-assed way of fixing something you apparently
>> didn't expect when you purchased. I'll cross-post this and see if
>> woodworkers have some better ideas.
>> I assume you wipe the stain?
>
> Yes, I did do what the instructions said about applying the stain,
> leaving it there for a certain amount of time, and then wiping it. I
> thought it was fairly interesting the way the stains worked and looked
> by doing that. Earlier I had tried MinWax "Polyshades" which is a
> combination of stain and polyurethane in one. That was okay, and it
> would be a lot easier, but then I read that Polyshades is not supposed
> to be used on floors -- I am not sure why -- so I guess that's out.
>
> Thanks for all of your help and suggestions. It does appear that you
> know a lot about all of this and have a lot of experience with it.

> .... The
> issue you are dealing with is a less than ideal selection of
> wood....if you read the details of each type of red oak on the
> website, you will see that. The "rustic" grade is the leftovers,
> with knots, less-than-desireable grain, etc. Always a good learning
> experience ...

> of wear and tear - unless there is a flood or animals toileting on
> oak floors, it is hard to damage it. Done properly, it is also
> pretty easy to maintain. Taking off shoes at the door will help :o) I'd
> take solid oak before pergo-type c=== any day.
> I stripped oak kitchen cabinets for a friend once because I was out of
> work and needed money. Only after I slathered on paint remover did I
> realize the end panels of the cabinets were not solid oak like rest of
> the cabinet...they were particle board with printed grain. I was
> already on the verge of nervous breakdown and that almost put me over
> the edge. I got out my art stuff and between wood stain and a few
> brush strokes with oil paint I was able to fake the grain pretty
> well. Not obvious. I also painted fake woodgrain on floor boards
> for a doll house. If you have spots that really stick out like a
> sore thumb, you can paint in - with a light touch - enough grain to
> camouflage the spots before you do final finish.

> norminn@earthlink.net wrote:
>> .... The
>> issue you are dealing with is a less than ideal selection of
>> wood....if you read the details of each type of red oak on the
>> website, you will see that. The "rustic" grade is the leftovers,
>> with knots, less-than-desireable grain, etc. Always a good learning
>> experience ...
>
> Yep, that and few other stupid choices on my part turned this whole thing
> into a big mess. So, for now, I am just going to slog my way through this
> and chalk it up as an expensive and seemingly neverending learning
> experience. Next time, prefinished hardwood for sure -- just install it and
> walk out the door with nothing to finish. Plus, by buying unfinished wood,
> and too low of a grade of wood to boot, I ended up with way more wasted wood
> than I would have had with prefinished wood. Oh well.

>
> :o) You still have a good solid floor that will take lots
>> of wear and tear - unless there is a flood or animals toileting on
>> oak floors, it is hard to damage it. Done properly, it is also
>> pretty easy to maintain. Taking off shoes at the door will help :o) I'd
>> take solid oak before pergo-type c=== any day.
>> I stripped oak kitchen cabinets for a friend once because I was out of
>> work and needed money. Only after I slathered on paint remover did I
>> realize the end panels of the cabinets were not solid oak like rest of
>> the cabinet...they were particle board with printed grain. I was
>> already on the verge of nervous breakdown and that almost put me over
>> the edge. I got out my art stuff and between wood stain and a few
>> brush strokes with oil paint I was able to fake the grain pretty
>> well. Not obvious. I also painted fake woodgrain on floor boards
>> for a doll house. If you have spots that really stick out like a
>> sore thumb, you can paint in - with a light touch - enough grain to
>> camouflage the spots before you do final finish.
>
> I like the story about the cabinets and it almost putting you over the edge.
> I know the feeling.
>
>

> >> makes the wood look bad -- as if it was poorly stained.
> > Can you elaborate on how it looks "bad"? =A0Geesh...red oak should be
> > beautiful! =A0I don't know flooring or wood grades involved in new mfg.
> > flooring, just lots of old furniture. =A0Is the flooring a brand name?
> I bought it at Lumber Liquidators (http://LumberLiquidators.com). =A0It's
> unfinished #2 Red Oak (with their product number of RO22, I think). =A0Th=

> it looks bad is that the grain absorbs the clear polyurethane and what
> started out as a very light colored wood becomes dark, blotchy, grainy,
> junky-looking wood. =A0When I apply any color of oil-based stain, the sta=
> absorbs in a way that the wood grain looks and is whatever color the stai=
> makes it. =A0But applying clear polyurethane doesn't do the same thing.

> I now have a new unfinished red oak hardwood floor installed in an
> apartment that I will be renting out.
> What I want is a truly *CLEAR* finish to put down on the new
> unfinished flooring.
> I have extra flooring that I have set up so I can test various
> finishes. I have already tested a number of stains and, if I have
> to, I will go with one of those. But, what I really want is to be
> able to put a completely clear finish over the new unfinished
> hardwood flooring. I like the way it looks now and I would like to
> be able to keep that look and coloration. All of the so-called
> "clear" polyurethane finishes I have tried so far are not really
> clear. They are amber color, and they also stain and darken the wood
> grain.

> 2) I haven't tested out water-based polyurethane products yet. I get
> the impression that they can be more clear than oil-based
> polyurethane. MinWax sells a clear water-based base coat and a clear
> water-based polyurethane that goes over the base coat. The clear
> base coat is supposed to seal the tannins (or something like that) in
> the wood so it doesn't darken, and then hopefully the top coat won't
> darken the wood when it is applied.

> Are water-based polyurethane finishes okay for hardwood floors?

> Are they durable enough compared to oil-based polyurethanes?

> Are there any special cleaning requirements or instructions for
> water-based
> finishes that are different than for oil-based polyurethane finishes?

> Can I later cover a water-based polyurethane finish with an oil-based
> polyurethane finish? I think the answer to that one is "no", but I
> thought I would ask anyway.