Drywall sag

	Drywall sag

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Subject

Author

Date

Drywall sag

Eigenvector

12-25-2006

tbasc@bellsouth...

BobK207

trader4

Eigenvector

George E. Cawth...

Edwin Pawlowski

Eigenvector

nicksanspam

BobK207

Edwin Pawlowski

Joseph Meehan

bamboo

Steve Barker

Father Haskell

Eigenvector

Don Young

HeyBub

bowgus

Bob (but not TH...

bowgus

Eigenvector

HerHusband

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Posted by George E. Cawthon on December 25, 2006, 7:49 pm

Eigenvector wrote:

>> BobK207 wrote:

>>> Eigenvector wrote:

>>>> If I have ceiling joists that are 48" apart, will 5/8" drywall sag if

>>>> mounted on it?

>>>>

>>>> I'm not seeing too much information about that around, even though I'm

>>>> pretty sure 48" is pretty standard framing for a basement.

>>>>

>>>> I made the mistake of putting 1/2" up the first time - bad bad mistake

>>>> that

>>>> cost me dearly. But 5/8" isn't that much more. The idea of installing

>>>> 2x4's between the studs isn't my idea of a fun time, especially since

>>>> it

>>>> will introduce more margins for error unless I'm a demon for

>>>> measurements.

>>>>

>>>> I am also considering the idea of using plywood backing over the joists

>>>> as a

>>>> way to give the drywall a larger surface to attach to - even if it

>>>> isn't

>>>> structural it will still remove any sagging. But that option has the

>>>> detraction of reducing my headroom by 1/4" or more. I know it doesn't

>>>> sound

>>>> like a lot, but it all adds up - not to mention it will make adding

>>>> lighting

>>>> fixtures a huge pain in the ass since you can't cut plywood with a

>>>> drywall

>>>> saw

>>> Ceiling joists at 48" are way too far apart, even for 5/8" ....if you

>>> want the ceiling to look flat

>>>

>>> IMO even 5/8 is a stretch at 24" .....I would use 1/2 with joists at 16

>>>

>>> cheers

>>> Bob

>>>

>>> PS the drywall / plywood combo will cut very easily with a jig saw

>> I'd be curious to know where any building code allows 48" as routine

>> ceiling joist spacing, whether in a basement or anywhere else. I'm

>> betting you don't have a building permit.

> Not required, I'm repairing existing work - I asked first. But thanks for

> playing.

> As for 48" separation, I've seen a lot of houses with this kind of joist

> separation. Perhaps its peculiar to my house construction, pier and post

> foundation, but certainly not unique.

It is not pier and post, it is post and beam. Yes
it is common in some parts of the country and it
is for the bottom floor. The posts are usually on
8 foot center and the beams are 4 feet apart.
Beams are often double 2x8's or double 2x10's. It
is used for crawl spaces because who would want to
live in that kind of room? Sounds like a basement
that was put in after the house was constructed
with a crawl space.

Or, are you talking about old type of post and
beam construction with very large beams and longer
distances between posts?

In any case, the minimum you need are 2x4's
between beams with the 2x4's spaced on 16 inch
centers. Or use a drop ceiling, not drywall.

Posted by Edwin Pawlowski on December 25, 2006, 8:12 am

> If I have ceiling joists that are 48" apart, will 5/8" drywall sag if

> mounted on it?

Yes, it will look like crap

> I'm not seeing too much information about that around, even though I'm

> pretty sure 48" is pretty standard framing for a basement.

No, it is not

> I made the mistake of putting 1/2" up the first time - bad bad mistake

> that cost me dearly. But 5/8" isn't that much more. The idea of

> installing 2x4's between the studs isn't my idea of a fun time, especially

> since it will introduce more margins for error unless I'm a demon for

> measurements.

One method looks like crap and you have verified that. The other method is
correct. Your choice, do it right or a second half assed job. You can get
away with 2 x 3.

> I am also considering the idea of using plywood backing over the joists as

> a way to give the drywall a larger surface to attach to - even if it isn't

> structural it will still remove any sagging. But that option has the

> detraction of reducing my headroom by 1/4" or more. I know it doesn't

> sound like a lot, but it all adds up - not to mention it will make adding

> lighting fixtures a huge pain in the ass since you can't cut plywood with

> a drywall saw.

That certainly narrow down the options. 1/4 plywood is not going to help
much anyway. That too may sag at 48" spans. That gravity thing is not going
away.

Posted by Eigenvector on December 25, 2006, 1:03 pm

>> If I have ceiling joists that are 48" apart, will 5/8" drywall sag if

>> mounted on it?

> Yes, it will look like crap

>> I'm not seeing too much information about that around, even though I'm

>> pretty sure 48" is pretty standard framing for a basement.

> No, it is not

I see this in a lot of houses where I live, especially in downstairs
garages.

The roof joists are all 24".

>> I made the mistake of putting 1/2" up the first time - bad bad mistake

>> that cost me dearly. But 5/8" isn't that much more. The idea of

>> installing 2x4's between the studs isn't my idea of a fun time,

>> especially since it will introduce more margins for error unless I'm a

>> demon for measurements.

> One method looks like crap and you have verified that. The other method

> is correct. Your choice, do it right or a second half assed job. You

> can get away with 2 x 3.

>> I am also considering the idea of using plywood backing over the joists

>> as a way to give the drywall a larger surface to attach to - even if it

>> isn't structural it will still remove any sagging. But that option has

>> the detraction of reducing my headroom by 1/4" or more. I know it

>> doesn't sound like a lot, but it all adds up - not to mention it will

>> make adding lighting fixtures a huge pain in the ass since you can't cut

>> plywood with a drywall saw.

> That certainly narrow down the options. 1/4 plywood is not going to help

> much anyway. That too may sag at 48" spans. That gravity thing is not

> going away.

That sucks. That adds a hell of a lot more work that has to be done.

Attaching the studs to the existing joists itself is going to be a trick

Nothing for it then but to do it right.

Posted by on December 25, 2006, 2:17 pm

How about screwing 3 46" 2x3s or lighter steel studs to the drywall before
screwing the drywall edges to the joists on 4' centers?

Nick

Posted by BobK207 on December 25, 2006, 2:22 pm

Eigenvector wrote:

> >

> >> If I have ceiling joists that are 48" apart, will 5/8" drywall sag if

> >> mounted on it?

> >

> > Yes, it will look like crap

> >

> >>

> >> I'm not seeing too much information about that around, even though I'm

> >> pretty sure 48" is pretty standard framing for a basement.

> >

> > No, it is not

> I see this in a lot of houses where I live, especially in downstairs

> garages.

> The roof joists are all 24".

> >>

> >> I made the mistake of putting 1/2" up the first time - bad bad mistake

> >> that cost me dearly. But 5/8" isn't that much more. The idea of

> >> installing 2x4's between the studs isn't my idea of a fun time,

> >> especially since it will introduce more margins for error unless I'm a

> >> demon for measurements.

> >

> > One method looks like crap and you have verified that. The other method

> > is correct. Your choice, do it right or a second half assed job. You

> > can get away with 2 x 3.

> >

> >>

> >> I am also considering the idea of using plywood backing over the joists

> >> as a way to give the drywall a larger surface to attach to - even if it

> >> isn't structural it will still remove any sagging. But that option has

> >> the detraction of reducing my headroom by 1/4" or more. I know it

> >> doesn't sound like a lot, but it all adds up - not to mention it will

> >> make adding lighting fixtures a huge pain in the ass since you can't cut

> >> plywood with a drywall saw.

> >

> > That certainly narrow down the options. 1/4 plywood is not going to help

> > much anyway. That too may sag at 48" spans. That gravity thing is not

> > going away.

> That sucks. That adds a hell of a lot more work that has to be done.

> Attaching the studs to the existing joists itself is going to be a trick

> Nothing for it then but to do it right.

I'm thinking that some mis-communication is going on
here........support members for drywall or even plywood would be
difficult to get to perform at 48" oc

that's just too far for the sheet material to span unless, in the case
of plywood, it was really thick

maybe we need a better description of the exisitng condition & the
project objective

You mention what seems to be a post & pier foundation system?

what size are these "ceiling joists" that are at 48" oc? are these
really "support beams" for the floor joists above?

I may have given poor advice based my lack of understanding of the
situation

cheers
Bob

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