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Finally finished my replacement of the galvanized pipes

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Finally finished my replacement of the galvanized pipes Eigenvector 03-05-2007
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Posted by Goedjn on March 9, 2007, 10:54 am


On Thu, 8 Mar 2007 16:54:30 -0500, "Berkshire Bill"

>
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I just read on the Taco web site (they make the hot water circulating
>>>>>pumps)
>>>>>that plain tubing loses 60 Btu per hour per foot while insulated pipe
>>>>>loses
>>>>>30 Btu per hour per foot.
>>>>
>>>> Mine doesn't
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>There has to be some heat loss in moving water through tubing. What
>>>method
>>>of measurement are you using to arrive at 0% loss.
>>>
>>
>> Failed your reading comprehension, didn't you?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>The comment about heat loss re-enforced the comment from the Taco site.
>Where's the flaw in comprehension?
>

Conflating "not losing 30 BTU/ft/hr" with "0%" heat loss?


Posted by Edwin Pawlowski on March 7, 2007, 10:06 pm



>>I just read on the Taco web site (they make the hot water circulating
>>pumps)
>>that plain tubing loses 60 Btu per hour per foot while insulated pipe
>>loses
>>30 Btu per hour per foot.
>
> Mine doesn't

Oh, it is losing something. Certainly the extra insulation helps, but there
is a loss.



Posted by on March 7, 2007, 6:30 pm



>scott21230@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>I would support it more often then every 32 inches, but that's just me.
>>
>>I am also curious about the double insulation??
>
> Very simple really,
>
> Use the 4 ft foam insulation sticks from home depot. Then wrap
>that with 3 1/2 " fiberglass wall insulation in a spiral, and finally
>wrap clear plastic (loosely so as not to over compress the fiberglass)
>around that to hold it all together.
>
> Water sitting in the pipe stays hot/warm for hours after a shower.

It's a miracle! If 1" of US R5 insulation + 3.5" of R11 insulation has
a R16x12/4.5 = 42.6 ft^2-h-F/Btu thermal resistance, ie k = 1/42.6
= 0.0234 and 1' of 1/2" pipe has R = ln(4.5/0.5)/(2Pik) = 14.9 h-F/Btu
and C = Pi(0.5/24)^2x62.33 = 0.085 Btu/F and RC = 1.27 hours, 120 F
pipe water would cool to 70+(120-70)e^(-3/1.27) = 74.7 in a 70 F room.

Nick


Posted by Berkshire Bill on March 8, 2007, 1:14 am



>
>>scott21230@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>>I would support it more often then every 32 inches, but that's just me.
>>>
>>>I am also curious about the double insulation??
>>
>> Very simple really,
>>
>> Use the 4 ft foam insulation sticks from home depot. Then wrap
>>that with 3 1/2 " fiberglass wall insulation in a spiral, and finally
>>wrap clear plastic (loosely so as not to over compress the fiberglass)
>>around that to hold it all together.
>>
>> Water sitting in the pipe stays hot/warm for hours after a shower.
>
> It's a miracle! If 1" of US R5 insulation + 3.5" of R11 insulation has
> a R16x12/4.5 = 42.6 ft^2-h-F/Btu thermal resistance, ie k = 1/42.6
> = 0.0234 and 1' of 1/2" pipe has R = ln(4.5/0.5)/(2Pik) = 14.9 h-F/Btu
> and C = Pi(0.5/24)^2x62.33 = 0.085 Btu/F and RC = 1.27 hours, 120 F
> pipe water would cool to 70+(120-70)e^(-3/1.27) = 74.7 in a 70 F room.
>
> Nick
>

At least your toughts are readable !

Bill



Posted by Oren on March 5, 2007, 12:33 pm


On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 22:04:31 -0800, "Eigenvector"

>I finally bit the bullet and did it. I replaced all my hot water lines with
>PEX. This is one of those jobs I'd been pussyfooting around with. But
>today for some reason I finally got the gumption up to do the entire job the
>proper way.
>
>What a colossal pain in the ass that was. It wasn't the PEX that was a
>pain, it was getting rid of the galvanized that was the pain. Crouched down
>in the crawlspace with the spiders whacking away at the foundation for 2
>hours to open up the concrete just enough to get rid of a single 1/2" elbow
>that was buried in a 6" beam on top of the foundation. I don't fear spiders
>any more after that ordeal. The rest of the hour was spent pulling 3/4" PEX
>line through that hole in the foundation and hoping the PEX wouldn't snag on
>a nail or sharp rock. I ripped the hell out of the sheetrock in the garage
>stringing the PEX up to the water heater - no biggie I'm replacing it all
>anyway. I turned on the juice and voila - I forgot to crimp the 3/4" inlet
>into my manifold. The amount of water was dramatic - especially since my
>water is about 30 psi, maybe more. So after crimping that I tried again and
>this time no problems so far. I have 2 lines that I suspect need to be
>corrected, but I'll have to get to them later - the crimp ring is a little
>too far away from the fitting for my comfort.
>
>The difference in water pressure is astonishing - I can actually take a
>shower without cranking up the hot water tap all the way. I might even be
>able to turn down the water temp on the heater - right now its at 160 F to
>compensate for the lack of pressure I was getting.
>
>I tell you one thing, I had the 3/4" line suspended from J hangers in the
>crawlspace to keep it relatively supported, after turning on the water the
>PEX line sagged and expanded dramatically. It almost makes me wonder if I
>should go back in and use something other than J hangers.

My system (Vanguard recommends) 7 inches of slack every 50 foot.
Horizontally supported every 32 inches.....using tubing clamps of the
proper size.

You mentioned a crawl space. The PEX needs to be protected from
freezing.

>I ought to upload some photos of this, assuming it holds I'm pretty proud of
>this job.
>




--
Oren

"Well, it doesn't happen all the time, but when it happens, it happens
constantly."

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