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Flickering Lights and Buss Arching

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Flickering Lights and Buss Arching daokfella 06-28-2007
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Posted by Tony Hwang on June 28, 2007, 10:57 am
daokfella wrote:
> I've been in my home almost 10 years and all of a sudden, a single
> circuit in my home started to flicker and intermittently power on and
> off (the breaker never tripped). I've done electrical work in the past
> when I finished my basement. The first thing I thought of was to
> replace the breaker. It's a Cutler Hammer twin (slimline) 15A breaker.
>
> After replacing it, the problem still occurred (so it was unlikely it
> was the breaker). After some diagnosising, I noticed that there was
> some arching ocurring in one of the terminals on the neutral buss bar.
> I tapped on the panel, and a small spark shot from the terminal. I
> turned off the circuit in question, and the arching and spark ceased.
> I then knew that the arching neutral belonged to the circuit in
> question.
>
> I found it odd that there are one or two ground wires on the neutral
> buss bar. However, the neutral buss bar is right on top of the ground
> buss bar. Don't they go to the same place anyway? Is this odd or OK? I
> know I've seen some panels where the ground buss is totally separated
> from the neutral buss.
>
> This neutral wire is sharing the same screw terminal on the buss bar
> with a ground wire from another circuit. I shut off the main breaker
> and screwed down the terminal firmly which fixed the problem. However,
> 5 days later, it started happening again. No sparks fly when I tap on
> the panel, but there is slight arching in that same termAinal.
>
> Just eyeballing it, it looks like my neutral is a 14 gauge whilst the
> ground in the same terminal might be a 12 gauge which would explain
> why the neutral is not secured enough by the screw terminal. I am
> going to to shut off the main breaker do some housekeeping on the
> terminals making sure the same gauge wire is shared by neutrals in the
> same terminal.
>
> 1. Does it look like I've diagnosed the problem and I'm taking the
> correct measures to fix it?
>
> 2. Why would this happen all of sudden after 10 years of living in the
> home? The terminal screw didn't seem all that loose when I tightened
> it the first time. I barely got 1/16 to 1/8 of a turn on it.
>
> 3. Is it OK for neutrals and grounds to share the same terminal on the
> neutral buss bar? Of different or same circuits?
>
> 4. Any other comments to add on what I've described?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jason
>
Hmmm,
First thing you'd do is checking for loose wire(hot, neutral, ground)
for that circuit. At the panel neutral and ground is same.

Posted by Joe on June 28, 2007, 12:59 pm

daokfella wrote:

>snip<

> 4. Any other comments to add on what I've described?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jason

One terminal, one wire is the rule. Go to an electrical distributor
outlet and buy an additional buss bar for your panel. There are often
pre-tapped mounting holes for the new bar in the enclosure. Mount and
bond it to the other busses, then segregate your neutral and ground
wires to single occupancy. Cost should be under $10 unless you're
driving a giant SUV to the store. HTH

Joe


Posted by Stormin Mormon on June 29, 2007, 11:18 am
Electricity should never arch. It should spark in a straight
line, not arched. If your electricity is arching, that's not
good. Curved like the golden arches (McDonalds) isn't normal.
Have you checked to see if the power company is selling you
straight electricity, or the new curved kind?

As to resolving the arcing, since you're already in the panel
box, how about shut off the breaker, and put the neutral into a
different hole, in the neutral bar? Then, screw it down snugly
and see if that helps.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
.

: I've been in my home almost 10 years and all of a sudden, a
single
: circuit in my home started to flicker and intermittently power
on and
: off (the breaker never tripped). I've done electrical work in
the past
: when I finished my basement. The first thing I thought of was
to
: replace the breaker. It's a Cutler Hammer twin (slimline) 15A
breaker.
:
: After replacing it, the problem still occurred (so it was
unlikely it
: was the breaker). After some diagnosising, I noticed that there
was
: some arching ocurring in one of the terminals on the neutral
buss bar.
: I tapped on the panel, and a small spark shot from the
terminal. I
: turned off the circuit in question, and the arching and spark
ceased.
: I then knew that the arching neutral belonged to the circuit in
: question.
:
: I found it odd that there are one or two ground wires on the
neutral
: buss bar. However, the neutral buss bar is right on top of the
ground
: buss bar. Don't they go to the same place anyway? Is this odd
or OK? I
: know I've seen some panels where the ground buss is totally
separated
: from the neutral buss.
:
: This neutral wire is sharing the same screw terminal on the
buss bar
: with a ground wire from another circuit. I shut off the main
breaker
: and screwed down the terminal firmly which fixed the problem.
However,
: 5 days later, it started happening again. No sparks fly when I
tap on
: the panel, but there is slight arching in that same termAinal.
:
: Just eyeballing it, it looks like my neutral is a 14 gauge
whilst the
: ground in the same terminal might be a 12 gauge which would
explain
: why the neutral is not secured enough by the screw terminal. I
am
: going to to shut off the main breaker do some housekeeping on
the
: terminals making sure the same gauge wire is shared by neutrals
in the
: same terminal.
:
: 1. Does it look like I've diagnosed the problem and I'm taking
the
: correct measures to fix it?
:
: 2. Why would this happen all of sudden after 10 years of living
in the
: home? The terminal screw didn't seem all that loose when I
tightened
: it the first time. I barely got 1/16 to 1/8 of a turn on it.
:
: 3. Is it OK for neutrals and grounds to share the same terminal
on the
: neutral buss bar? Of different or same circuits?
:
: 4. Any other comments to add on what I've described?
:
: Thanks,
:
: Jason
:



Posted by M Q on June 29, 2007, 1:31 pm
Stormin Mormon wrote:

> Electricity should never arch. It should spark in a straight
> line, not arched.
...

Oh, yeah?
Check out:
http://www.fugly.com/videos/1342/Lugo_SWR.html
or

http://bumracing.com/v-web/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=album02&id=Lugo_SWR


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