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Posted by Don Young on July 25, 2007, 10:06 pm
>
>> If it never had any, why worry about it? Most houses I've ever seen
>> don't have the nuts installed on the bolts anyway.
>>
> Chuckle. Seen (or not seen?) that a lot myself. If the framing crew gets
> ahead of the kid assigned shit duties like that, and the floor gets decked
> over before anyone notices, it tends to fall through the cracks. And if
> the J-bolts are rusty, crusted with concrete, or at a bad angle, or too
> short, and the kid isn't a go-getter....
>
> (My old man was the GC or strawboss, so I pulled a lot of punch list duty
> as a kid. Putting those washers and nuts on from below, and getting a
> socket wrench on them, was often a lot of fun, especially in crawlspaces.)
>
> aem sends....
>
I have seen a lot of houses built on cement block foundations without
anything securing the sill plates to the blocks. It does not seem to be a
problem and I am not sure that the blocks would help much in an uplift
anyhow. Houses have been built for centuries just sitting on rock piles or
other supports.
However, I agree that having it bolted down strongly is a good idea. I am
not sure that just bolting the sill plates makes it a strong connection
between the ground and the rest of the house. It would depend a lot on the
type of foundation wall and on the strength of the framing connections.
Don Young
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Posted by aemeijers on July 26, 2007, 1:22 pm
>
>>
>>> If it never had any, why worry about it? Most houses I've ever seen
>>> don't have the nuts installed on the bolts anyway.
>>>
>> Chuckle. Seen (or not seen?) that a lot myself. If the framing crew gets
>> ahead of the kid assigned shit duties like that, and the floor gets
>> decked over before anyone notices, it tends to fall through the cracks.
>> And if the J-bolts are rusty, crusted with concrete, or at a bad angle,
>> or too short, and the kid isn't a go-getter....
>>
>> (My old man was the GC or strawboss, so I pulled a lot of punch list duty
>> as a kid. Putting those washers and nuts on from below, and getting a
>> socket wrench on them, was often a lot of fun, especially in
>> crawlspaces.)
>>
>> aem sends....
>>
> I have seen a lot of houses built on cement block foundations without
> anything securing the sill plates to the blocks. It does not seem to be a
> problem and I am not sure that the blocks would help much in an uplift
> anyhow. Houses have been built for centuries just sitting on rock piles or
> other supports.
>
> However, I agree that having it bolted down strongly is a good idea. I am
> not sure that just bolting the sill plates makes it a strong connection
> between the ground and the rest of the house. It would depend a lot on the
> type of foundation wall and on the strength of the framing connections.
>
Not disagreeing- but back in the old days in the midwest, hurricane
straps/earthquake straps would have rated a 'Huh?' As a kid, a pack of
tornadoes came through a Real Cheap cookie cutter subdivision my father was
strawboss on (after his own high-end custom home company went belly up, it
was the only work he could get, much to his embarrasment.) I worked one
spring vaction on the cleanup of that subdivision, which was luckily mostly
still vacant. Several of the houses were sucked up off the foundations, and
the sill plates did stay attached to the joists. The J-bolts were still
sticking out of the concrete block, no nuts to be seen. If The J-bolt is in
a filled block cavity, and if the block foundation has the proper tie metal
every third course, and a rebar in filled holes every X feet, it is pretty
solid. A monolithic pour reinforced foundation would be much stronger,
probably.
If I ever had the money to build a house, yes I would strap foundation to
floor system, floor to studs, walls to rafters, etc. Pretty much what the
California,Florida, and similar region codes require. May only need it once
every hundred years when Mother Nature gets cranky, but it is so cheap and
easy to add during construction, it is real cheap insurance. Retrofit, of
course, is a much more expensive PITA.
aem sends....
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Posted by Bob on July 26, 2007, 4:06 pm
>
>>
>>>
>>>> If it never had any, why worry about it? Most houses I've ever
>>>> seen don't have the nuts installed on the bolts anyway.
>>>>
<snip>
As I understand it, anchor bolts are for the purpose of preventing
the sill from shifting, not necessarily to hold the building to the
foundation.
Bob-tx
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Posted by Wayne Whitney on July 25, 2007, 4:31 pm
> I'm replacing foundation plates and rim joists on the house.
I take it from this that the floor system bears directly on the mud
sills, and that is why you have can not install retrofit bolts from
above? If so, then as another poster suggested, take a look at the
Simpson products on this page:
http://www.strongtie.com/products/categories/foundation_anchors.html
In particular, consider using the FAP product if the edge of the
mudsill lines up exactly with the end of the foundation, or the UFP
product if it does not. Note that typically these would be used on
the inside edge of the foundation, not the outside edge. Be sure to
use corrosion resistant fasteners and hardware (hdg or stainless) for
anything contacting treated wood or concrete.
Good luck,
Wayne
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Posted by Ivan Vegvary on July 25, 2007, 6:18 pm
>
>> I'm replacing foundation plates and rim joists on the house.
>
> I take it from this that the floor system bears directly on the mud
> sills, and that is why you have can not install retrofit bolts from
> above? If so, then as another poster suggested, take a look at the
> Simpson products on this page:
>
> http://www.strongtie.com/products/categories/foundation_anchors.html
>
> In particular, consider using the FAP product if the edge of the
> mudsill lines up exactly with the end of the foundation, or the UFP
> product if it does not. Note that typically these would be used on
> the inside edge of the foundation, not the outside edge. Be sure to
> use corrosion resistant fasteners and hardware (hdg or stainless) for
> anything contacting treated wood or concrete.
>
> Good luck,
> Wayne
>
Wayne, you describe the condition exactly. The FAP will work fine. Using
corrosion resistant hardware did not occur to me. Thanks for the tip.
Ivan Vegvary
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