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Freezing pipe bursting mechanism spamTHISbrp 12-04-2006
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Posted by on December 4, 2006, 6:14 pm


OK, this thread is as attractive to trolls as any, but for serious
discussion- what is the actual mechanism of a pipe cracking/bursting
due to the water freezing?

OK, we all know water expands when frozen, and this is the root of it,
but beyond that...
I'll sketch out what I believe the mechanism is using a series of
examples.

make a big "U" out of a copper pipe, like this:

| |
| |
-----------------------------------

fill that puppy with water. Freeze under the following conditions:

1) leave ends open, start freezing at middle, freeze whole pipe working
out towards the ends.
predicted outcome- no burst pipe

2) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from left to
right
predicted outcome- no burst pipe

3) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from right to
left
predicted outcome- burst pipe

4) leave both ends open. Freeze from ends towards middle.
Predicted outcome- burst pipe.

Further prediction: the point where the pipe cracks/bursts will be at a
point where there is water in the pipe, not ice.

Discuss.

Dave


Posted by Chris Friesen on December 4, 2006, 7:12 pm


spamTHISbrp@yahoo.com wrote:

> 3) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from right to
> left
> predicted outcome- burst pipe
>
> 4) leave both ends open. Freeze from ends towards middle.
> Predicted outcome- burst pipe.

You forgot:

5) Put closed valve at one end. Freeze from middle or other end towards
valve. Burst pipe.

6) Put closed valves at both ends. Freeze from anywhere. Burst pipe.

More generally....block the pipe in two places, then start freezing the
enclosed water. It's got nowhere to go, so it bursts the pipe.

Chris

Posted by Dan Espen on December 5, 2006, 9:59 am



> spamTHISbrp@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>> 3) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from right to
>> left
>> predicted outcome- burst pipe
>> 4) leave both ends open. Freeze from ends towards middle.
>> Predicted outcome- burst pipe.
>
> You forgot:
>
> 5) Put closed valve at one end. Freeze from middle or other end
> towards valve. Burst pipe.
>
> 6) Put closed valves at both ends. Freeze from anywhere. Burst pipe.
>
> More generally....block the pipe in two places, then start freezing
> the enclosed water. It's got nowhere to go, so it bursts the pipe.

I've seen some pipes that have burst.

Before the pipe bursts, is will swell up.
This forms a reservoir which only makes the problem
worse because there is more water to freeze the next
time and the plug can't move up or down the pipe.

I've seen a really big bulb in copper, maybe
2 inches on a half inch pipe.
Galvanized should swell less before breaking.

Posted by MLD on December 5, 2006, 1:37 pm



>
> > spamTHISbrp@yahoo.com wrote:
> >
> >> 3) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from right to
> >> left
> >> predicted outcome- burst pipe
> >> 4) leave both ends open. Freeze from ends towards middle.
> >> Predicted outcome- burst pipe.
> >
> > You forgot:
> >
> > 5) Put closed valve at one end. Freeze from middle or other end
> > towards valve. Burst pipe.
> >
> > 6) Put closed valves at both ends. Freeze from anywhere. Burst pipe.
> >
> > More generally....block the pipe in two places, then start freezing
> > the enclosed water. It's got nowhere to go, so it bursts the pipe.
>
> I've seen some pipes that have burst.
>
> Before the pipe bursts, is will swell up.
> This forms a reservoir which only makes the problem
> worse because there is more water to freeze the next
> time and the plug can't move up or down the pipe.
>
> I've seen a really big bulb in copper, maybe
> 2 inches on a half inch pipe.
> Galvanized should swell less before breaking.

I've seen stainless steel tubing 1/8" in dia balloon to about 1/2" for
approx 1" in length. This occurred over time as trapped water went through
many freeze/ thaw cycles before it finally split along the sausage like
aneurism. As a note, to illustrate the power of expanding ice, it takes
about 20,000 psi (tension) to cause such a failure. This actually happened
on a aircraft part and it was jet fuel that leaked out all over the rear of
the aircraft and onto the tarmac. If it wasn't noticed and the engines
started it would have blown everything sky high.
MLD



Posted by Pop` on December 4, 2006, 7:54 pm


spamTHISbrp@yahoo.com wrote:
> OK, this thread is as attractive to trolls as any, but for serious
> discussion- what is the actual mechanism of a pipe cracking/bursting
> due to the water freezing?
>
> OK, we all know water expands when frozen, and this is the root of it,
> but beyond that...
> I'll sketch out what I believe the mechanism is using a series of
> examples.
>
> make a big "U" out of a copper pipe, like this:
>
>> |
>> |
> -----------------------------------
>
> fill that puppy with water. Freeze under the following conditions:
>
> 1) leave ends open, start freezing at middle, freeze whole pipe
> working out towards the ends.
> predicted outcome- no burst pipe
>
> 2) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from left to
> right
> predicted outcome- no burst pipe
>
> 3) Leave right-hand end open, seal left-hand end. Freeze from right to
> left
> predicted outcome- burst pipe
>
> 4) leave both ends open. Freeze from ends towards middle.
> Predicted outcome- burst pipe.
>
> Further prediction: the point where the pipe cracks/bursts will be at
> a point where there is water in the pipe, not ice.
>
> Discuss.
>
> Dave

I assume you have a -reason- for this dissertation? IT's not exactly on
topic, after all and not even an analog for Home Repair??



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