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French drain help..... chrisexv6 04-17-2007
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Posted by hallerb@aol.com on April 18, 2007, 3:26 pm


>
>
>
>
>
> >Overbuilding is good :)
>
> >But I didnt want to go too crazy, in case something I add effects
> >something that is already there (i.e. draining the gutter runoff into
> >the same trench as the French drain....would the second pipe from the
> >gutter interfere with the operation of the french drain pipe).
>
> >The french drain pipe will be open to daylight, about 60' away, down a
> >hill. =A0So I should get good gravity flow. =A0I might be able to use the
> >berm idea for some of that 60' run, which would help keep the water
> >over the french drain area, and give it a chance to get out (in the
> >case of torrential downpours). =A0The only question I have at this point
> >is if I should tap the gutters into the same pipe, run another pipe in
> >the same trench, or run a separate trench for the gutter pipe.
>
> >BTW, what depth are you suggesting for the french drain? =A0I was
> >thinking 24" at its highest....with a pitch of 1/4" per foot, the
> >depth where it sees daylight would be about 40" or so. =A0Could the
> >pitch be lowered to 1/8" per foot? =A0I think I saw that suggested, but
> >again, overbuilding is better than underbuilding.
>
> >-Chris
>
> well, you can use the same pipe for the landscape drain and
> the downspout drain, as long as it's big enough. for both.
> To figure that out, you could estimate the maximum amount of
> water you expect to have to move per minute. =A0Or you could just
> go with a 30" culvert, so you've got a big enough pipe for
> wild animals, and small children, and a weapons cache.
>
> In any case, bury it deep enough to be below the frostline,
> if any.
>
> You'll want to build a spreader dam or rockfall or
> something at the outflow, or it =A0will
> build you a nice gulley in a year or so.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

DONT USE THE SAME PIPE! pipe is cheap, better they be kept seperate.

why add more water to a french drain system, it just lessens its
efficency.

one inch of water over a whole roof can be thousands of gallons of
water


Posted by chrisexv6 on April 18, 2007, 8:15 pm


>
>
>
>
> > >Overbuilding is good :)
>
> > >But I didnt want to go too crazy, in case something I add effects
> > >something that is already there (i.e. draining the gutter runoff into
> > >the same trench as the French drain....would the second pipe from the
> > >gutter interfere with the operation of the french drain pipe).
>
> > >The french drain pipe will be open to daylight, about 60' away, down a
> > >hill. ?So I should get good gravity flow. ?I might be able to use the
> > >berm idea for some of that 60' run, which would help keep the water
> > >over the french drain area, and give it a chance to get out (in the
> > >case of torrential downpours). ?The only question I have at this point
> > >is if I should tap the gutters into the same pipe, run another pipe in
> > >the same trench, or run a separate trench for the gutter pipe.
>
> > >BTW, what depth are you suggesting for the french drain? ?I was
> > >thinking 24" at its highest....with a pitch of 1/4" per foot, the
> > >depth where it sees daylight would be about 40" or so. ?Could the
> > >pitch be lowered to 1/8" per foot? ?I think I saw that suggested, but
> > >again, overbuilding is better than underbuilding.
>
> > >-Chris
>
> > well, you can use the same pipe for the landscape drain and
> > the downspout drain, as long as it's big enough. for both.
> > To figure that out, you could estimate the maximum amount of
> > water you expect to have to move per minute. ?Or you could just
> > go with a 30" culvert, so you've got a big enough pipe for
> > wild animals, and small children, and a weapons cache.
>
> > In any case, bury it deep enough to be below the frostline,
> > if any.
>
> > You'll want to build a spreader dam or rockfall or
> > something at the outflow, or it ?will
> > build you a nice gulley in a year or so.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> DONT USE THE SAME PIPE! pipe is cheap, better they be kept seperate.
>
> why add more water to a french drain system, it just lessens its
> efficency.
>
> one inch of water over a whole roof can be thousands of gallons of
> water

No problem using separate pipe. The issue I was thinking would be the
separate pipe in the same trench causing a problem with the water
getting to the french drain. I suppose its no


Posted by chrisexv6 on April 18, 2007, 8:15 pm


>
>
>
> >Overbuilding is good :)
>
> >But I didnt want to go too crazy, in case something I add effects
> >something that is already there (i.e. draining the gutter runoff into
> >the same trench as the French drain....would the second pipe from the
> >gutter interfere with the operation of the french drain pipe).
>
> >The french drain pipe will be open to daylight, about 60' away, down a
> >hill. So I should get good gravity flow. I might be able to use the
> >berm idea for some of that 60' run, which would help keep the water
> >over the french drain area, and give it a chance to get out (in the
> >case of torrential downpours). The only question I have at this point
> >is if I should tap the gutters into the same pipe, run another pipe in
> >the same trench, or run a separate trench for the gutter pipe.
>
> >BTW, what depth are you suggesting for the french drain? I was
> >thinking 24" at its highest....with a pitch of 1/4" per foot, the
> >depth where it sees daylight would be about 40" or so. Could the
> >pitch be lowered to 1/8" per foot? I think I saw that suggested, but
> >again, overbuilding is better than underbuilding.
>
> >-Chris
>
> well, you can use the same pipe for the landscape drain and
> the downspout drain, as long as it's big enough. for both.
> To figure that out, you could estimate the maximum amount of
> water you expect to have to move per minute. Or you could just
> go with a 30" culvert, so you've got a big enough pipe for
> wild animals, and small children, and a weapons cache.
>
> In any case, bury it deep enough to be below the frostline,
> if any.
>
> You'll want to build a spreader dam or rockfall or
> something at the outflow, or it will
> build you a nice gulley in a year or so.

Actually didnt think about the frost line, but I was planning on
having the downspouts as they are now, but i would put a drain grate
at the bottom of each for them to flow into. If for some reason the
drain pipe froze up, I could always just redirect the downspouts
farther away.

I *think* the bucket size on the mini-loader is either 18" or 24"
wide. Would 18" be wide enough for 2 4" pipes? Obviously the pipes
would fit, but would they be too close to each other? For the
downspout drain, Id use regular PVC (non-perforated) because the
perforated pipe in the same trench should do the job of the french
drain. Although........would 2 sets of perforated pipe be better than
1 in this case? Im not sure.

-Chris


Posted by Goedjn on April 19, 2007, 11:32 am



>>
>>
>>
>> >Overbuilding is good :)
>>
>> >But I didnt want to go too crazy, in case something I add effects
>> >something that is already there (i.e. draining the gutter runoff into
>> >the same trench as the French drain....would the second pipe from the
>> >gutter interfere with the operation of the french drain pipe).
>>
>> >The french drain pipe will be open to daylight, about 60' away, down a
>> >hill. So I should get good gravity flow. I might be able to use the
>> >berm idea for some of that 60' run, which would help keep the water
>> >over the french drain area, and give it a chance to get out (in the
>> >case of torrential downpours). The only question I have at this point
>> >is if I should tap the gutters into the same pipe, run another pipe in
>> >the same trench, or run a separate trench for the gutter pipe.
>>
>> >BTW, what depth are you suggesting for the french drain? I was
>> >thinking 24" at its highest....with a pitch of 1/4" per foot, the
>> >depth where it sees daylight would be about 40" or so. Could the
>> >pitch be lowered to 1/8" per foot? I think I saw that suggested, but
>> >again, overbuilding is better than underbuilding.
>>
>> >-Chris
>>
>> well, you can use the same pipe for the landscape drain and
>> the downspout drain, as long as it's big enough. for both.
>> To figure that out, you could estimate the maximum amount of
>> water you expect to have to move per minute. Or you could just
>> go with a 30" culvert, so you've got a big enough pipe for
>> wild animals, and small children, and a weapons cache.
>>
>> In any case, bury it deep enough to be below the frostline,
>> if any.
>>
>> You'll want to build a spreader dam or rockfall or
>> something at the outflow, or it will
>> build you a nice gulley in a year or so.
>
>Actually didnt think about the frost line, but I was planning on
>having the downspouts as they are now, but i would put a drain grate
>at the bottom of each for them to flow into. If for some reason the
>drain pipe froze up, I could always just redirect the downspouts
>farther away.
>
>I *think* the bucket size on the mini-loader is either 18" or 24"
>wide. Would 18" be wide enough for 2 4" pipes? Obviously the pipes
>would fit, but would they be too close to each other? For the
>downspout drain, Id use regular PVC (non-perforated) because the
>perforated pipe in the same trench should do the job of the french
>drain. Although........would 2 sets of perforated pipe be better than
>1 in this case? Im not sure.
>
>-Chris

Well, I suspect that If you're using a separate pipe to handle
the roof water, that pipe shouldn't be perforated.
You use perforated pipe if you're trying to either collect
water, or distribute it, and you don't want to distribute water
into the the trench, because there's already too much
water there, and you're not using that pipe to collect water,
because there's a different pipe doing that job.

You might consider talking to a landscape architect. I'd think
this would be a fairly well-studied problem so it shouldn't
take days of consultation to come up with an optimal solution.



Posted by chrisexv6 on April 17, 2007, 9:00 pm


> My reason for suggesting putting in some kind of landscape feature with
> a berm is that a a rise of a couple of inches might be enough to divert
> water that runs down from your neighbor. It would be exceedingly easy
> (on a normal sized lot) to lay down that much soil and keep it in place
> with sod or other plants. You would need to figure out where the water
> will go if you divert it.
>
> We had lots of small problems in the lawn at our condo that I fiddled
> with. One was that after many years of running edgers along the same
> line, there was quite a hump of lawn along the building with a ditch
> next to it. In some places, it had exposed sprinkler pipes that would
> then get run over by the mower. In some places I just hit it with a
> strong stream of water - the grass stayed in place and the dirt went
> into the ditch. Wasted some water :o) I found concrete doughnuts 6"
> down, with no protection of sprinkler heads that hubby had to keep
> fixing. Landscape problems sometimes have simple solutions.
>
> We also had a great deal of erosion behind our seawall - not visible in
> places because the sod was so healthy it covered the tunnels between the
> washouts - kind of dangerous to walk on. That was fixed by putting some
> filter fabric behind the weep-holes in the seawall, gravel behind it,
> and filled up with soil.
>
> You may need French drains, but that is a major project. If soil is
> saturated, from continuous rain, they might not do any good, but I
> really don't know.

Its a possibility.......I could take the 2" extra rise than I can get
without hitting the bottom of the siding, and basically make a ledge
out of it......2" of soil out 10', would create a decent height berm
between us and the neighbors. French drains are a lot of work...the
only reason I even thought of it is because I have the machine coming
for another project (son needs a swing set!), but since it will be
here for almost 3 days and 8 machine hours, I figured while I was at
it I might as well fix some things around (literally!) the house.

I like the berm idea.......the issue I have with it is where it will
run off into my yard. My back yard is basically a hill, my plan was
to divert the water back there to let it run right down the hill. It
would be a pretty long berm :) its about a 60' distance. It would be
a long french drain as well, but that would be level with my yard, and
less intrusive. In the area next to the house (where my neighbors
water flows), I might do both the berm and the french drain, gradually
lowering the berm into the level of the rest of the yard.

-Chris


Page 3 of 5       < 1 2 3 > last >>
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