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Garage Short Circuit?

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Garage Short Circuit? MJR 08-15-2005
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Posted by MJR on August 15, 2005, 6:03 pm


symptoms
1. garage lights won't turn on
2. garage door opener won't go up/down
3. when light switch is off, garage opener sensors light up
4. when light switch is on (lights don't go on), sensors go off
5. Voltage tester shows 104 volts in all outlets in garage


what should I do (besides calling an electrician)?

the problem began soon after the first rains in 6 weeks

the power to the garage is underground conduit from the house, under
the yard to the garage.



Posted by Jeff Wisnia on August 16, 2005, 12:55 am


MJR wrote:
> symptoms
> 1. garage lights won't turn on
> 2. garage door opener won't go up/down
> 3. when light switch is off, garage opener sensors light up
> 4. when light switch is on (lights don't go on), sensors go off
> 5. Voltage tester shows 104 volts in all outlets in garage
>
>
> what should I do (besides calling an electrician)?
>
> the problem began soon after the first rains in 6 weeks
>
> the power to the garage is underground conduit from the house, under
> the yard to the garage.
>

10 to 1 you have a splice or screw connection which has gone bad in
either the hot or neutral feed wires to the garage. It is not completely
open, but has unusably high resistance.

At the very low current drawn by the garage door sensors there's still
enough voltage (the 104 volts you measured) to let the sensors light up.
Any load much heavier than that causes the voltage to collapse to near
nothing. That's why trying to turn on a light makes the sensors go out.

Good luck finding it. If you are lucky and there are no splices or
joints in the wires underground you may just find that there's a loose
screw connection or wirenut on something like the circuit breaker
feeding that line or maybe in a box in the garage where the underground
wires split out to the various things using power in the garage.

Try using a light bulb with an appropriate socket and leads instead of
your voltage tester. That'll give you a more realistic load to test with.

HTH,

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia

(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)

"Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented."


Posted by Doug Miller on August 16, 2005, 1:15 am


>symptoms
>1. garage lights won't turn on
>2. garage door opener won't go up/down
>3. when light switch is off, garage opener sensors light up
>4. when light switch is on (lights don't go on), sensors go off
>5. Voltage tester shows 104 volts in all outlets in garage
>
>
>what should I do (besides calling an electrician)?

Turn the circuit breaker(s) off, or pull the fuse(s).
>
>the problem began soon after the first rains in 6 weeks
>
>the power to the garage is underground conduit from the house, under
>the yard to the garage.

Sounds like there's a leak in the conduit, and a break in the cable.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.


Posted by Joseph Meehan on August 16, 2005, 1:12 pm


MJR wrote:
> symptoms
> 1. garage lights won't turn on
> 2. garage door opener won't go up/down
> 3. when light switch is off, garage opener sensors light up
> 4. when light switch is on (lights don't go on), sensors go off
> 5. Voltage tester shows 104 volts in all outlets in garage
>
>
> what should I do (besides calling an electrician)?
>
> the problem began soon after the first rains in 6 weeks
>
> the power to the garage is underground conduit from the house, under
> the yard to the garage.

For the moment, let's ignore that 104 Volts as I believe it is a red
herring.

Go check the circuit breakers, Is one tripped? I suspect not. Now
check out all your GFIs. One or more of them should be protecting your
garage. They may be in the garage, kitchen bath or breaker box. It the
test and reset button on each one.

If that gets you power, the 104V you found was only a very low amp
induced current and you never would have been able to measure it without
that digital meter you used.


--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit




Posted by Jeff Wisnia on August 16, 2005, 10:09 am


Joseph Meehan wrote:

> MJR wrote:
>
>>symptoms
>>1. garage lights won't turn on
>>2. garage door opener won't go up/down
>>3. when light switch is off, garage opener sensors light up
>>4. when light switch is on (lights don't go on), sensors go off
>>5. Voltage tester shows 104 volts in all outlets in garage
>>
>>
>>what should I do (besides calling an electrician)?
>>
>>the problem began soon after the first rains in 6 weeks
>>
>>the power to the garage is underground conduit from the house, under
>>the yard to the garage.
>
>
> For the moment, let's ignore that 104 Volts as I believe it is a red
> herring.
>
> Go check the circuit breakers, Is one tripped? I suspect not. Now
> check out all your GFIs. One or more of them should be protecting your
> garage. They may be in the garage, kitchen bath or breaker box. It the
> test and reset button on each one.
>
> If that gets you power, the 104V you found was only a very low amp
> induced current and you never would have been able to measure it without
> that digital meter you used.
>
>

Joseph, I'm usually in agreement with you, but if there's enough current
to light up the opener sensors I doubt that it's being provided by
induced or capacitively coupled current. But, maybe if they are
extremely low current devices there is a possibility of that happening.

Nothing to be lost by following the steps you describe, they are
certainly the simplest thing to start with, but I'll still put my money
on a high resistance joint somewhere.

That's assuming the OP's description and our understanding of what he
means are correct, something that isn't always true on this newsgroup. <G>

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia

(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)

"Truth exists; only falsehood has to be invented."


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