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Generator transfer sub-panel: is this OK?

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Generator transfer sub-panel: is this OK? Tman 07-31-2005
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Posted by Tman on July 31, 2005, 11:35 am


Going to install a generator tranfer sub-panel.. I'm getting a permit, but I
wonder if there is anything obvious here that I plan on doing that would be
amiss before i get that permit....

I have a 8-place Square D subpanel with a 70A switch and a 30A breaker wired
with one of those mechanical interlocks that prevent both from being on at
the same time.

So I'll run the 30A breaker via 10/4 romex to an outside plug, which is
where I'll connect my approx 5500W portable generator.

Then I'll run the 70A switch (2 hots) and a neutral via some 6ga wire in a
conduit to a 60A 2-pole breaker in my main panel. Including a 8ga ground in
the same conduit, being sure that the ground and neutral are not tied
together in the sub-panel.

Then I'll load the remaining 4 spots in the subpanel up with the QOT tandem
breakers. One of these is for a 240 circuit (water pump), and i'll tie two
adjacent breakers together with a tie pin from Square D to make a 2-pole
breaker. This leaves 6 circuits for 120V service.

Two things I want to make sure about:

If I add all the breakers in the subpanel up, I'll have 70A (2x20, 2x15) per
leg, which exceeds the 60A subpanel feed breaker and certainly the 30A
generator feed breaker, and even more so, the 5500W generator capacity. But
I don't think the feed breaker will ever trip, and I'll just have to be
careful when on genny. Is there anything not kosher about this setup?

I need to transfer a handful of circuits from the main panel to the sub
panel. Can I do this the easy way.. by leaving each circuit run in the main
panel, and splicing the hots ONLY with a wire nut to feed to the subpanel
via wire of the appropriate guage in a conduit? Anything to be aware of
here, especially if it is OK to leave the ground and neutrual for these
transferred circuits terminated in the main panel? I could run those to,
but not if I don't need to...


Thanks!!
Tman.




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Posted by RBM on July 31, 2005, 12:35 pm


It would seem to me the easiest way to accomplish what you want is to buy a
six or ten circuit transfer panel kit from HD or similar place. This has a
ready made panel with multiple switches built in and a cable with a pile of
wires you connect right into your main panel, takes just a couple of hours
and you're done. The way you're going about it is fine, you don't add up the
size of the breakers, but the loads attached to them and I believe you
cannot use a panel as a junction box the way you planned and need to remove
the cables from your main panel and install them into the generator sub
panel.



"Tman" <tman9_ at _comcast.net (remove underscores)> wrote in message
> Going to install a generator tranfer sub-panel.. I'm getting a permit, but
> I wonder if there is anything obvious here that I plan on doing that would
> be amiss before i get that permit....
>
> I have a 8-place Square D subpanel with a 70A switch and a 30A breaker
> wired with one of those mechanical interlocks that prevent both from being
> on at the same time.
>
> So I'll run the 30A breaker via 10/4 romex to an outside plug, which is
> where I'll connect my approx 5500W portable generator.
>
> Then I'll run the 70A switch (2 hots) and a neutral via some 6ga wire in a
> conduit to a 60A 2-pole breaker in my main panel. Including a 8ga ground
> in the same conduit, being sure that the ground and neutral are not tied
> together in the sub-panel.
>
> Then I'll load the remaining 4 spots in the subpanel up with the QOT
> tandem breakers. One of these is for a 240 circuit (water pump), and i'll
> tie two adjacent breakers together with a tie pin from Square D to make a
> 2-pole breaker. This leaves 6 circuits for 120V service.
>
> Two things I want to make sure about:
>
> If I add all the breakers in the subpanel up, I'll have 70A (2x20, 2x15)
> per leg, which exceeds the 60A subpanel feed breaker and certainly the 30A
> generator feed breaker, and even more so, the 5500W generator capacity.
> But I don't think the feed breaker will ever trip, and I'll just have to
> be careful when on genny. Is there anything not kosher about this setup?
>
> I need to transfer a handful of circuits from the main panel to the sub
> panel. Can I do this the easy way.. by leaving each circuit run in the
> main panel, and splicing the hots ONLY with a wire nut to feed to the
> subpanel via wire of the appropriate guage in a conduit? Anything to be
> aware of here, especially if it is OK to leave the ground and neutrual for
> these transferred circuits terminated in the main panel? I could run
> those to, but not if I don't need to...
>
>
> Thanks!!
> Tman.
>
>




Posted by Pop on July 31, 2005, 1:58 pm


I think this site might help you out in some of your
decisions:
http://www.nbmc.com/emergen/index.html

Offhand it sounds OK but it's fuzzy in a couple of
areas (to me). The single most important thing is to
not allow the generator, under any normal "fault'
conditions, to feed the power lines.

A Transfer Switch panel is the easiest way to do it,
IMO, and the most reliable. Lots of companies make
them. Yours almost, not quite sounds like a transfer
switch, so I'm not making too many judgements on the
validity of your plans here.

HTH
Pop

"Tman" <tman9_ at _comcast.net (remove underscores)>
wrote in message
> Going to install a generator tranfer sub-panel.. I'm
> getting a permit, but I wonder if there is anything
> obvious here that I plan on doing that would be amiss
> before i get that permit....
>
> I have a 8-place Square D subpanel with a 70A switch
> and a 30A breaker wired with one of those mechanical
> interlocks that prevent both from being on at the
> same time.
>
> So I'll run the 30A breaker via 10/4 romex to an
> outside plug, which is where I'll connect my approx
> 5500W portable generator.
>
> Then I'll run the 70A switch (2 hots) and a neutral
> via some 6ga wire in a conduit to a 60A 2-pole
> breaker in my main panel. Including a 8ga ground in
> the same conduit, being sure that the ground and
> neutral are not tied together in the sub-panel.
>
> Then I'll load the remaining 4 spots in the subpanel
> up with the QOT tandem breakers. One of these is for
> a 240 circuit (water pump), and i'll tie two adjacent
> breakers together with a tie pin from Square D to
> make a 2-pole breaker. This leaves 6 circuits for
> 120V service.
>
> Two things I want to make sure about:
>
> If I add all the breakers in the subpanel up, I'll
> have 70A (2x20, 2x15) per leg, which exceeds the 60A
> subpanel feed breaker and certainly the 30A generator
> feed breaker, and even more so, the 5500W generator
> capacity. But I don't think the feed breaker will
> ever trip, and I'll just have to be careful when on
> genny. Is there anything not kosher about this
> setup?
>
> I need to transfer a handful of circuits from the
> main panel to the sub panel. Can I do this the easy
> way.. by leaving each circuit run in the main panel,
> and splicing the hots ONLY with a wire nut to feed to
> the subpanel via wire of the appropriate guage in a
> conduit? Anything to be aware of here, especially if
> it is OK to leave the ground and neutrual for these
> transferred circuits terminated in the main panel? I
> could run those to, but not if I don't need to...
>
>
> Thanks!!
> Tman.
>
>




Posted by toller on July 31, 2005, 6:07 pm


Why are you screwing around with this, when real transfer switches are
available? I would be reluctant to buy a house that contained what you are
describing; fearing you had done equally odd things elsewhere.

If you chose to design your own. just be sure that the net current going
though any metal hole must be zero. It was not clear if you were doing
that.

If you try to draw more than 5500w from you generator it will let you know
quickly by stalling. Hopefully you will not burn anything out in the
process.




Posted by RBM on July 31, 2005, 3:00 pm



> Why are you screwing around with this, when real transfer switches are
> available? I would be reluctant to buy a house that contained what you
> are describing; fearing you had done equally odd things elsewhere.
>
> If you chose to design your own. just be sure that the net current going
> though any metal hole must be zero. It was not clear if you were doing
> that.
>
> If you try to draw more than 5500w from you generator it will let you know
> quickly by stalling. Hopefully you will not burn anything out in the
> process.
>




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