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Has Electric wire gotten smaller for the same guager?

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Has Electric wire gotten smaller for the same guager? Colbyt 08-01-2007
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Posted by Colbyt on August 1, 2007, 4:35 pm
Since it is too hot to play outside I was stripping some wire in recycle
box. It looked like some of the old 12 gauge was bigger than the new stuff.
So I stripped exactly 1 foot of 12/2 wg 20 years old and 2-3 years old and
weighed it on my postal scale. They sure as heck did not look the same or
weight the same.

As the insulation has gotten better and more heat resistant has the wire
been down-sized?

Colbyt



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Posted by Travis Jordan on August 1, 2007, 5:33 pm
> Since it is too hot to play outside I was stripping some wire in recycle
> box. It looked like some of the old 12 gauge was bigger than the new
> stuff. So I stripped exactly 1 foot of 12/2 wg 20 years old and 2-3 years
> old and weighed it on my postal scale. They sure as heck did not look the
> same or weight the same.
>
> As the insulation has gotten better and more heat resistant has the wire
> been down-sized?

Postal scale? Probably not accurate enough for this measurement. Anyway,
if you stripped it the insulation doesn't matter in this calculation.

1 foot of 12GA copper wire should weigh .316 oz. What did your samples
weigh?

AWG Copper Wire Table
AWG Diam. (mils) Circular mils Ohms/1000ft Feet per Pound
12 80.8 6529 1.619
50.59




Posted by mm on August 1, 2007, 6:18 pm
wrote:

>> Since it is too hot to play outside I was stripping some wire in recycle
>> box. It looked like some of the old 12 gauge was bigger than the new
>> stuff. So I stripped exactly 1 foot of 12/2 wg 20 years old and 2-3 years
>> old and weighed it on my postal scale. They sure as heck did not look the
>> same or weight the same.
>>
>> As the insulation has gotten better and more heat resistant has the wire
>> been down-sized?
>
>Postal scale? Probably not accurate enough for this measurement. Anyway,

Accuracy is not really a concern when comparing two weights on the
same scale.

Precision is what matters. One should either weigh the same thing
several times to see if the reading is always the same, or average the
readings if they are different**. Same thing with the other item.

**If the readings are different from one time to the next, one should
tap the scale with the weight on it, to see if the reading changes.
If it does, it may be possible to lubricate the scale. That may
eliminate the problem. If the problem exists or persists, it's better
to tap the scale every time to see where the reading comes to rest.


All that said, my postal scales have been quite consistent in its
readings. They are adjustable to get better accuracy, but like I say,
accuracy is not important when comparing two weights on the same
scale.



>if you stripped it the insulation doesn't matter in this calculation.
>
>1 foot of 12GA copper wire should weigh .316 oz. What did your samples
>weigh?
>
>AWG Copper Wire Table
>AWG Diam. (mils) Circular mils Ohms/1000ft Feet per Pound
> 12 80.8 6529 1.619
>50.59
>
>


Posted by EXT on August 1, 2007, 7:51 pm
I have noticed that insulation is now thinner than on wires made 20 or 40
years ago.

> wrote:
>
>>> Since it is too hot to play outside I was stripping some wire in recycle
>>> box. It looked like some of the old 12 gauge was bigger than the new
>>> stuff. So I stripped exactly 1 foot of 12/2 wg 20 years old and 2-3
>>> years
>>> old and weighed it on my postal scale. They sure as heck did not look
>>> the
>>> same or weight the same.
>>>
>>> As the insulation has gotten better and more heat resistant has the wire
>>> been down-sized?
>>
>>Postal scale? Probably not accurate enough for this measurement. Anyway,
>
> Accuracy is not really a concern when comparing two weights on the
> same scale.
>
> Precision is what matters. One should either weigh the same thing
> several times to see if the reading is always the same, or average the
> readings if they are different**. Same thing with the other item.
>
> **If the readings are different from one time to the next, one should
> tap the scale with the weight on it, to see if the reading changes.
> If it does, it may be possible to lubricate the scale. That may
> eliminate the problem. If the problem exists or persists, it's better
> to tap the scale every time to see where the reading comes to rest.
>
>
> All that said, my postal scales have been quite consistent in its
> readings. They are adjustable to get better accuracy, but like I say,
> accuracy is not important when comparing two weights on the same
> scale.
>
>
>
>>if you stripped it the insulation doesn't matter in this calculation.
>>
>>1 foot of 12GA copper wire should weigh .316 oz. What did your samples
>>weigh?
>>
>>AWG Copper Wire Table
>>AWG Diam. (mils) Circular mils Ohms/1000ft Feet per Pound
>> 12 80.8 6529 1.619
>>50.59
>>
>>
>



Posted by Colbyt on August 2, 2007, 5:40 pm

> Postal scale? Probably not accurate enough for this measurement. Anyway,
> if you stripped it the insulation doesn't matter in this calculation.
>
> 1 foot of 12GA copper wire should weigh .316 oz. What did your samples
> weigh?
>

I would love to correct that typo in the subject but that would make a new
thread.

I snipped a comment or two from Handyman's post also. Will address that
down the page.

10 foot of 12/2 wg uf (30 foot total) yielded 9 OZ that is just under your
9.48 figure.
1 foot #4 single wire yielded 2 oz.
1 foot old se6 (3 wires 3 foot total) yielded 4.20 OZ.
1 foot old 12/2 wg (3 foot total) yielded 1 oz.
1 foot 8/3 wg (3 @ 8, 1 @ 12? ) yielded 3oz.

1 foot new #4 AL gave me a whole 1oz. Most likely not worth the effort. I
know why the electrician did not take the leftovers.

<quote>That's fine, but I do think the copper wire is thinner too,
and I dont understand how that could be. 12 gauge needs to BE 12
gauge. The only thing that I can think of, and this is just a
guess..... Modern wire is a TRUE 12 gauge. Copper is expensive these
days, whereas the older wire was not as precise, and as long as the
thinnest sections were 12 gauge, thicker sections were fine. Like I
said, just a guess....</quote>

I have to agree with everything you said in the quote. Not all the old
stuff I see is that way. But some of it sure the heck is.


Colbyt



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