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Is my electrician dangerous? Please read Doobielicious 06-09-2008
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Posted by SteveB on June 13, 2008, 1:42 pm

>
>
>>
>> If you have a general contractor why are you dealing with the
>> electrician?
>> Just tell them you want it to pass inspection and let them deal with it.
>
> You might want to give your contractor a "Heads Up" on what you saw.
>
> What was described just "ain't right" (i.e.: not safe) and you may
> consider dropping a dime on the electrician and ensure that the inspector
> looks closely at the work.
>
> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

"may consider" ? Rat the bastard out. If he doesn't care if you go up in a
house fire, he's worth the dime.

Steve



PexSupply QuikTrak 468x60
Posted by Roemax on June 9, 2008, 9:52 pm


call your codes officer and ask him if its legal
that will smarten up your electrician


> OK. My electrician has 1 feed for one of my bedrooms and a couple plugs in
> hallway. The feed coming from my basement to my 2nd story has a short.
> They
> think the drywall or siding guys screwed into the wire. The circuit was
> tripping so what he did was tied the neutral white wire into the breaker
> and
> then tied the black into the neutral bar of my panel. All works
> plugs/lights
> work. I caught this before and asked why he put the black on the neutral
> bar
> and the neutral wire on the breaker. He said he had a short somewhere and
> did that to find where the problem is.
>
> So when I was at work I was told by my contractor that the electrical was
> fixed up and ready for final inspection. Curious as I am, I decided to
> take
> the cover off of my panel and found that he didn't make the change but
> that
> he put black tape over the neutral wire and back into the circuit breaker
> and left the black on the neutral bar.
>
> I called my contractor (not the electrician) and told him what he did and
> said that there was no way that this would pass inspection. Am I wrong? Is
> this a fix that would pass inspection? Is this a common thing for
> electricians to do? This to me seems like a lazy fix, but am not sure if
> this presents a hazard.
>
> Like I said everything works in my hallway and bedroom so I am thinking he
> reversed his wiring to make things work. So what it appears to me is that
> the black wire is hitting the ground wire form when someone screwed the
> drywall or siding.
>
> Please offer me some advice and please let me know what I should say to
> the
> electrician when I question him on it. I know he will say hey don't worry
> it
> is safe, but I need to know if it is not safe and if it is not safe why it
> isn't safe to do this. That way he will not jerk me around and it would
> appear like I know what I am talking about.
>
> I am almost thinking about telling my general contractor that he will not
> get paid for my reno until this electrical situation is fixed properly and
> I
> am thinking about getting another electrician to make the fix because I
> don't think I can trust this electrician.
>
> Any and all advice is welcome
>
> Thanks in Advance
>
>



Posted by Doug Miller on June 9, 2008, 10:04 pm
>OK. My electrician has 1 feed for one of my bedrooms and a couple plugs in
>hallway. The feed coming from my basement to my 2nd story has a short. They
>think the drywall or siding guys screwed into the wire. The circuit was
>tripping so what he did was tied the neutral white wire into the breaker and
>then tied the black into the neutral bar of my panel. All works plugs/lights
>work. I caught this before and asked why he put the black on the neutral bar
>and the neutral wire on the breaker. He said he had a short somewhere and
>did that to find where the problem is.

[snip rest]

Yes, the electrician *is* dangerous. Very dangerous. There are at least two
serious safety hazards in what he did: First, by reversing hot and neutral,
he's instantly put every switch on that circuit on the neutral side instead of
on the hot side where it belongs. Second, whatever caused the short to ground
is still there; it's just connected to the neutral instead of the hot --
trouble is, the neutral carries current too, and so whatever's touching that
is providing an alternate path for that current to return to ground, possibly
through somebody.

Explain this to the general contractor, and demand a *different* electrician.
Don't allow the first one back on your property, not even to try to fix his
own screw-up -- no assurance that he's competent to do it right, and plenty of
evidence that he's not.

Posted by John Grabowski on June 10, 2008, 8:45 am

>>OK. My electrician has 1 feed for one of my bedrooms and a couple plugs in
>>hallway. The feed coming from my basement to my 2nd story has a short.
>>They
>>think the drywall or siding guys screwed into the wire. The circuit was
>>tripping so what he did was tied the neutral white wire into the breaker
>>and
>>then tied the black into the neutral bar of my panel. All works
>>plugs/lights
>>work. I caught this before and asked why he put the black on the neutral
>>bar
>>and the neutral wire on the breaker. He said he had a short somewhere and
>>did that to find where the problem is.
>
> [snip rest]
>
> Yes, the electrician *is* dangerous. Very dangerous. There are at least
> two
> serious safety hazards in what he did: First, by reversing hot and
> neutral,
> he's instantly put every switch on that circuit on the neutral side
> instead of
> on the hot side where it belongs. Second, whatever caused the short to
> ground
> is still there; it's just connected to the neutral instead of the hot --
> trouble is, the neutral carries current too, and so whatever's touching
> that
> is providing an alternate path for that current to return to ground,
> possibly
> through somebody.
>
> Explain this to the general contractor, and demand a *different*
> electrician.
> Don't allow the first one back on your property, not even to try to fix
> his
> own screw-up -- no assurance that he's competent to do it right, and
> plenty of
> evidence that he's not.


I agree. This must be fixed. However to find the problem holes may need to
be made in the drywall. The electrician should be able to narrow the
problem down a little by disconnecting wires at each outlet and switch until
it goes away. If no one will cooperate, tell the electrical inspector. He
won't pass the inspection until the problem is resolved. The electrical
inspectors that I have dealt with carry their own little plug-in
polarity/ground/GFI tester. If that was inserted into one of your
receptacles it would have immediately shown that a problem exists.

Occasionally I find a situation similar to this in large scale condo,
townhouse, and single family developments. Some of which are many years
old. It takes me hours to find the problem or I just wind up refeeding the
circuit with new cable. Unfortunately there isn't always a neat way to
accomplish this. Better to nip your problem now.


Posted by SteveB on June 10, 2008, 12:29 pm

>
>>>OK. My electrician has 1 feed for one of my bedrooms and a couple plugs
>>>in
>>>hallway. The feed coming from my basement to my 2nd story has a short.
>>>They
>>>think the drywall or siding guys screwed into the wire. The circuit was
>>>tripping so what he did was tied the neutral white wire into the breaker
>>>and
>>>then tied the black into the neutral bar of my panel. All works
>>>plugs/lights
>>>work. I caught this before and asked why he put the black on the neutral
>>>bar
>>>and the neutral wire on the breaker. He said he had a short somewhere and
>>>did that to find where the problem is.
>>
>> [snip rest]
>>
>> Yes, the electrician *is* dangerous. Very dangerous. There are at least
>> two
>> serious safety hazards in what he did: First, by reversing hot and
>> neutral,
>> he's instantly put every switch on that circuit on the neutral side
>> instead of
>> on the hot side where it belongs. Second, whatever caused the short to
>> ground
>> is still there; it's just connected to the neutral instead of the hot --
>> trouble is, the neutral carries current too, and so whatever's touching
>> that
>> is providing an alternate path for that current to return to ground,
>> possibly
>> through somebody.
>>
>> Explain this to the general contractor, and demand a *different*
>> electrician.
>> Don't allow the first one back on your property, not even to try to fix
>> his
>> own screw-up -- no assurance that he's competent to do it right, and
>> plenty of
>> evidence that he's not.
>
>
> I agree. This must be fixed. However to find the problem holes may need
> to be made in the drywall. The electrician should be able to narrow the
> problem down a little by disconnecting wires at each outlet and switch
> until it goes away. If no one will cooperate, tell the electrical
> inspector. He won't pass the inspection until the problem is resolved.
> The electrical inspectors that I have dealt with carry their own little
> plug-in polarity/ground/GFI tester. If that was inserted into one of your
> receptacles it would have immediately shown that a problem exists.
>
> Occasionally I find a situation similar to this in large scale condo,
> townhouse, and single family developments. Some of which are many years
> old. It takes me hours to find the problem or I just wind up refeeding
> the circuit with new cable. Unfortunately there isn't always a neat way
> to accomplish this. Better to nip your problem now.

I used the testers when I was a safety inspector. It is incredible the
amount of circuits that are wired wrong.

Steve



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