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Paint matching (am I expecting too much...?) Nate Nagel 11-03-2009
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Posted by Frank on November 4, 2009, 12:16 pm


> >A while back I had to demo a kitchen cabinet to allow a new fridge to be
> >moved in... =A0I was in a time crunch and didn't have time to go to a re=
al
> >paint store that day so I went to That Orange-Colored Store and had them
> >mix me a quart of paint. =A0I took with me a vent grille that had been
> >painted over to color match. =A0The guy tried, and even wasted a quart o=
n his
> >first try when it came out too dark (color is a flat white tinted slight=
ly
> >blue) second try looked good in the store but when I painted the wall it
> >ended up slightly more brownish-grey than the rest of the wall. =A0(I al=
so
> >used almost the whole quart just to cover the area that was behind one
> >large kitchen cabinet...)
> > Unfortunately this @#$@#$% color is on about half the walls in my house=
,
> > and I have a couple other little areas that I'd like to address (changi=
ng
> > light fixtures in living room and removing mirror over mantel; repainti=
ng
> > ceiling at top of stair landing where it was badly prepped; painting
> > kitchen ceiling where I demo'd an ugly fluorescent fixture and never
> > patched/painted the ceiling) but we're not quite ready to repaint any
> > whole rooms yet. =A0So I would really like to have a couple more quarts=
of
> > paint matched to the existing so I can keep doing spot repairs as I get
> > motivated and not have the house look all ghetto and have primer spots =
all
> > over the darn place until whatever room gets a full repaint.
> > Today I had a dentist's appt. in the AM so I left early and hit the
> > closest "real" paint store and brought the same vent grille with me. Th=
ey
> > "matched" it while I was visiting with Dr. Hook and I picked up two qua=
rts
> > (they used Benjamin Moore base.) =A0I just opened one and spread a litt=
le
> > paint on the corner of said vent, it looks like a pure white in
> > comparison. =A0Not even anywhere near as close as the paint I got from =
HD.
> > The few areas I've used the HD paint don't look awful, but it's obvious
> > that there's a paint mismatch. =A0Is that about the best I can hope for=
(in
> > which case I should go back to HD and get a couple more quarts of the s=
ame
> > thing I got last time,) or should I take everything back to the real pa=
int
> > store and let them try again? =A0I realize you can't see what I'm worki=
ng
> > with so you can't really say "that's about as good as it gets, you're
> > being too picky, just deal until you repaint" or "you can do better tha=
n
> > that, you've just had bad luck with paint guys" (but I guess that's kin=
d
> > of the feedback I really need)
> > Not sure if posting pics would help, but if it would, I can take a pic =
of
> > the last little spot I did, around the thermostat on the kitchen wall..=
.
> > nate
> > --
> > replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
> >http://members.cox.net/njnagel
> Paint is a bitch. =A0Even if you do save those things they put on the top=
of
> paint cans stating exactly how many parts of which color they put in it, =
you
> can have another gallon made down the road, and it comes out looking
> different.
> This can be for several reasons:
> The substrate. =A0Putting it on different things. =A0Different brands of
> drywall. =A0Kilz or no Kilz? =A0Primer or no primer? =A0Which primer? =A0=
How long
> has it been there, and how much UV rays from the sun has lightened it? =
=A0If
> it is in a kitchen or bath area, how much oil or steam has changed the
> color? =A0Paint looks different after it has soaked into a wall for five =
years
> than that which is a week old.
> I have kept those little color things, and gone back later and gotten
> EXACTLY the same mix, and painted it on, and it looks different than the
> paint on there. =A0Even clothes fade. =A0Car paint jobs fade.
> NEVER EVER EVER EVER LOOK AT PAINT UNTIL IT HAS DRIED A WEEK. =A0It takes=
that
> long to get even close to the color it's going to be.
> It's not so much a mismatch, as you can get exactly the same paint mixed =
and
> it won't match, it has to do with fading and lots of other factors.
> Solutions: =A0Do areas where the mismatching won't be obvious. =A0Repaint=
the
> whole thing from the get go. =A0Change the color scheme so it don't matte=
r.
> If you are doing remodeling, prime properly, or Kilz, and then, it may ta=
ke
> two or three coats to get it exactly right. =A0Lower expectations - what =
you
> think is an obvious mismatch won't be noticed by others.
> And lastly, consider the ambient light. =A0Lots of paints and colors look
> different when viewed at 9 AM versus 2 PM. =A0On a sunny day, or a cloudy=
day.
> HTH, just some things to ponder.
> Steve, who knows paint will drive you batty, but only if you let it.- Hid=
e quoted text -
> - Show quoted text -

Good points. The phenomenon of different appearing color in different
light is called metamerism (sic.)
I trust the machine's eye but exact match is impossible with the
metamerism problem.
I recommend, and have done myself, painting the whole wall in the room
that needs it, then any color mismatch with the other walls will not
be as evident.

Posted by JIMMIE on November 4, 2009, 12:30 pm


> >A while back I had to demo a kitchen cabinet to allow a new fridge to be
> >moved in... =A0I was in a time crunch and didn't have time to go to a re=
al
> >paint store that day so I went to That Orange-Colored Store and had them
> >mix me a quart of paint. =A0I took with me a vent grille that had been
> >painted over to color match. =A0The guy tried, and even wasted a quart o=
n his
> >first try when it came out too dark (color is a flat white tinted slight=
ly
> >blue) second try looked good in the store but when I painted the wall it
> >ended up slightly more brownish-grey than the rest of the wall. =A0(I al=
so
> >used almost the whole quart just to cover the area that was behind one
> >large kitchen cabinet...)
> > Unfortunately this @#$@#$% color is on about half the walls in my house=
,
> > and I have a couple other little areas that I'd like to address (changi=
ng
> > light fixtures in living room and removing mirror over mantel; repainti=
ng
> > ceiling at top of stair landing where it was badly prepped; painting
> > kitchen ceiling where I demo'd an ugly fluorescent fixture and never
> > patched/painted the ceiling) but we're not quite ready to repaint any
> > whole rooms yet. =A0So I would really like to have a couple more quarts=
of
> > paint matched to the existing so I can keep doing spot repairs as I get
> > motivated and not have the house look all ghetto and have primer spots =
all
> > over the darn place until whatever room gets a full repaint.
> > Today I had a dentist's appt. in the AM so I left early and hit the
> > closest "real" paint store and brought the same vent grille with me. Th=
ey
> > "matched" it while I was visiting with Dr. Hook and I picked up two qua=
rts
> > (they used Benjamin Moore base.) =A0I just opened one and spread a litt=
le
> > paint on the corner of said vent, it looks like a pure white in
> > comparison. =A0Not even anywhere near as close as the paint I got from =
HD.
> > The few areas I've used the HD paint don't look awful, but it's obvious
> > that there's a paint mismatch. =A0Is that about the best I can hope for=
(in
> > which case I should go back to HD and get a couple more quarts of the s=
ame
> > thing I got last time,) or should I take everything back to the real pa=
int
> > store and let them try again? =A0I realize you can't see what I'm worki=
ng
> > with so you can't really say "that's about as good as it gets, you're
> > being too picky, just deal until you repaint" or "you can do better tha=
n
> > that, you've just had bad luck with paint guys" (but I guess that's kin=
d
> > of the feedback I really need)
> > Not sure if posting pics would help, but if it would, I can take a pic =
of
> > the last little spot I did, around the thermostat on the kitchen wall..=
.
> > nate
> > --
> > replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
> >http://members.cox.net/njnagel
> Paint is a bitch. =A0Even if you do save those things they put on the top=
of
> paint cans stating exactly how many parts of which color they put in it, =
you
> can have another gallon made down the road, and it comes out looking
> different.
> This can be for several reasons:
> The substrate. =A0Putting it on different things. =A0Different brands of
> drywall. =A0Kilz or no Kilz? =A0Primer or no primer? =A0Which primer? =A0=
How long
> has it been there, and how much UV rays from the sun has lightened it? =
=A0If
> it is in a kitchen or bath area, how much oil or steam has changed the
> color? =A0Paint looks different after it has soaked into a wall for five =
years
> than that which is a week old.
> I have kept those little color things, and gone back later and gotten
> EXACTLY the same mix, and painted it on, and it looks different than the
> paint on there. =A0Even clothes fade. =A0Car paint jobs fade.
> NEVER EVER EVER EVER LOOK AT PAINT UNTIL IT HAS DRIED A WEEK. =A0It takes=
that
> long to get even close to the color it's going to be.
> It's not so much a mismatch, as you can get exactly the same paint mixed =
and
> it won't match, it has to do with fading and lots of other factors.
> Solutions: =A0Do areas where the mismatching won't be obvious. =A0Repaint=
the
> whole thing from the get go. =A0Change the color scheme so it don't matte=
r.
> If you are doing remodeling, prime properly, or Kilz, and then, it may ta=
ke
> two or three coats to get it exactly right. =A0Lower expectations - what =
you
> think is an obvious mismatch won't be noticed by others.
> And lastly, consider the ambient light. =A0Lots of paints and colors look
> different when viewed at 9 AM versus 2 PM. =A0On a sunny day, or a cloudy=
day.
> HTH, just some things to ponder.
> Steve, who knows paint will drive you batty, but only if you let it.- Hid=
e quoted text -
> - Show quoted text -

Matching off of something like a grill would be a pain. The paint guys
should have told you it may not work out. Whenever I paint something
that may have to be matched later I always save the info in my house
info binder.

Jimmie

Posted by blueman on November 5, 2009, 2:15 am


> This can be for several reasons:
> The substrate. Putting it on different things. Different brands of
> drywall. Kilz or no Kilz? Primer or no primer? Which primer? How long
> has it been there, and how much UV rays from the sun has lightened it? If
> it is in a kitchen or bath area, how much oil or steam has changed the
> color? Paint looks different after it has soaked into a wall for five years
> than that which is a week old.
> I have kept those little color things, and gone back later and gotten
> EXACTLY the same mix, and painted it on, and it looks different than the
> paint on there. Even clothes fade. Car paint jobs fade.
> NEVER EVER EVER EVER LOOK AT PAINT UNTIL IT HAS DRIED A WEEK. It takes that
> long to get even close to the color it's going to be.

Here is another reason. Sometimes the paint manufacturers change the
base composition.

I recently had the following experience. I went to my favorite local
paint store to get another gallon of the paint that the old-timer had
meticulously matched for me several years ago. At that time, he spent
about an hour with me using repeated rounds of adding slight amounts
of color, shaking the can, painting a swatch, drying it with a hair
dryer, waiting, then seeing how it matched and continuing until the
match was perfect. All for a gallon of paint.

Well, the other day when he made a new gallon using the old formula,
the match was way off -- even against a test swab made from the
original paint and kept in a dark area.

It turns out that Benjamin Moore changed the formulation of its bases
to reduce the VOC content and that messed up all the formulas.

Luckily, my guys is skilled and he was able to save the gallon by
using his magic to adjust the color by eye over several iterations.

This guy is worth his weight in gold and he doesn't seem to charge any
more than the other non big box paint stores.

Posted by on November 6, 2009, 9:00 am


wrote:

...
>Paint is a bitch. Even if you do save those things they put on the top of
>paint cans stating exactly how many parts of which color they put in it, you
>can have another gallon made down the road, and it comes out looking
>different.
>This can be for several reasons:

        I will add one more comment. Often you can do a single plane
(one wall) stopping at a physical edge and not have any problems. We
are accustumed to seeing slight differences on different walls as the
light will not be the same on two different walls.
....

Posted by ransley on November 3, 2009, 7:57 pm


> A while back I had to demo a kitchen cabinet to allow a new fridge to be
> moved in... =A0I was in a time crunch and didn't have time to go to a rea=
l
> paint store that day so I went to That Orange-Colored Store and had them
> mix me a quart of paint. =A0I took with me a vent grille that had been
> painted over to color match. =A0The guy tried, and even wasted a quart on
> his first try when it came out too dark (color is a flat white tinted
> slightly blue) second try looked good in the store but when I painted
> the wall it ended up slightly more brownish-grey than the rest of the
> wall. =A0(I also used almost the whole quart just to cover the area that
> was behind one large kitchen cabinet...)
> Unfortunately this @#$@#$% color is on about half the walls in my house,
> and I have a couple other little areas that I'd like to address
> (changing light fixtures in living room and removing mirror over mantel;
> repainting ceiling at top of stair landing where it was badly prepped;
> painting kitchen ceiling where I demo'd an ugly fluorescent fixture and
> never patched/painted the ceiling) but we're not quite ready to repaint
> any whole rooms yet. =A0So I would really like to have a couple more
> quarts of paint matched to the existing so I can keep doing spot repairs
> as I get motivated and not have the house look all ghetto and have
> primer spots all over the darn place until whatever room gets a full
> repaint.
> Today I had a dentist's appt. in the AM so I left early and hit the
> closest "real" paint store and brought the same vent grille with me.
> They "matched" it while I was visiting with Dr. Hook and I picked up two
> quarts (they used Benjamin Moore base.) =A0I just opened one and spread a
> little paint on the corner of said vent, it looks like a pure white in
> comparison. =A0Not even anywhere near as close as the paint I got from HD=
.
> The few areas I've used the HD paint don't look awful, but it's obvious
> that there's a paint mismatch. =A0Is that about the best I can hope for
> (in which case I should go back to HD and get a couple more quarts of
> the same thing I got last time,) or should I take everything back to the
> real paint store and let them try again? =A0I realize you can't see what
> I'm working with so you can't really say "that's about as good as it
> gets, you're being too picky, just deal until you repaint" or "you can
> do better than that, you've just had bad luck with paint guys" (but I
> guess that's kind of the feedback I really need)
> Not sure if posting pics would help, but if it would, I can take a pic
> of the last little spot I did, around the thermostat on the kitchen wall.=
..
> nate
> --
> replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Colors can be matched and are every day, you have to demand it and
have it dried out as a large sample like 4x4", not the drop of paint
they usualy try to get away with.

Page 5 of 9       < 1 2 3 > last >>
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