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Plumbing challenge? franz fripplfrappl 02-18-2008
|--> Re: Plumbing challenge? franz fripplfra...02-18-2008
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Posted by franz fripplfrappl on February 18, 2008, 2:54 pm
On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 14:00:46 -0500, gfretwell wrote:

> wrote:
>
>>Here's what I'd like to do:
>>
>>Run well water through a geothermal heat exchanger and then discharge
>>the same water into the yard and eventually into a pond.
>>
>>I prefer not to go underground and below frost depth with discharge
>>pipe.
>>
>>I would like to simply have water discharge above ground. How can this
>>be done without discharge pipe freezing?
>>
>>My first thought is a antisyphon device similar to what's on outdoor
>>spigots.
>>
>>Discharge pipe is 1".
>
> If you really think water is valuable you should be putting it back
> where it came from after you have sucked out some of the heat.

Thanks for opinion. Unfortunately DNR does not permit open loop
geothermal systems which go from one well and discharge into another.
This makes sense for conserving water but DNR is afraid of
contamination. Can't figure out how a "sealed" well system can get
contaminated.

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Posted by Edwin Pawlowski on February 18, 2008, 6:03 pm

> Can't figure out how a "sealed" well system can get
> contaminated.

You can't? You said in another post:
"We're using well water in an open loop geothermal installation. Water
goes through a heat exchanger which transfers it to fluid circulating
through radiant tubing."

What is circulating through the radiant tubing? Eventually, that water or
water plus chemical will leak into the system when the heat exchanger goes
bad. It may be one year, five years, twenty five years, but it will happen.



Posted by Wayne Whitney on February 18, 2008, 5:55 pm

> I would like to simply have water discharge above ground. How can this
> be done without discharge pipe freezing?

When the exterior air temperature is below freezing, will the
discharge be running constantly? And what is the discharge
temperature of the water?

If the water is running constantly, then depending on the discharge
temperature, flow rate and heat loss of the discharge pipe, the water
won't freeze. Unlike a circulating pond, which has no outside source
of heat except the pump motor, this discharge pipe will constantly be
fed with warmer than ambient water.

Even if the water flow isn't constant, it is possible that if you
empty the pipe when the discharge stops, then whatever ice forms near
the outlet will be melt by the next discharge cycle. Again, it
depends on the balance of heat flows.

Cheers, Wayne



Posted by Edwin Pawlowski on February 18, 2008, 5:58 pm

> Here's what I'd like to do:
>
> Run well water through a geothermal heat exchanger and then discharge the
> same water into the yard and eventually into a pond.
>
> I prefer not to go underground and below frost depth with discharge pipe.
>
> I would like to simply have water discharge above ground. How can this
> be done without discharge pipe freezing?

Discharging water to the yard in freezing weather sounds like a potential
problem. I visualize ice dams, backups into basements, kids and dogs sliding
on the ice into the pond and they system backing up leaving you with no
heat.

How much water are you talking about?



Posted by franz fripplfrappl on February 18, 2008, 7:01 pm
On Mon, 18 Feb 2008 18:56:02 -0500, David L. Martel wrote:

> Franz,
>
> Assuming the pond does not freeze solid, why not pipe your cold well
> water directly to the pond. I don't understand why you want to dump the
> water in your yard.
> I'd also be concerned about eventually draining your aquifer or other
> water source. I thought folks put the heat exchanger down in the well
> rather than pump the water around.
>
> Dave M.

The pond is 200 feet from building. If it works, I'd like to discharge
water into a small water feature/stream which eventually leads to pond.
Cheaper than trenching and laying pipe.

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