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Re: Are we the only ones getting screwed ????? Steve 03-29-2008
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Posted by Smitty Two on April 13, 2008, 4:47 am
gfretwell@aol.com wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 19:50:02 -0700, Smitty Two
>
> > gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> >
> >> On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 10:57:02 -0700, aspasia wrote:
> >>
> >> >> I generally fly first class and they treat me fine.
> >> >
> >> >Apres toi, le deluge!
> >> >
> >> >Aspasia
> >>
> >> A first class train ride will cost a lot more than a first class plane
> >> ride.
> >> The discount price on a train will be more than the discount price on
> >> a plane and you will be in the cattle car for 3 days to get across the
> >> country. I'm sure Americans who think the microwave is too slow will
> >> be linng up for the train.
> >
> >The key AISI is using appropriate technology for the task at hand.
> >Taking a train across the country may not have many advantages. But for
> >some shorter trips, a train may be the fastest, easiest, and least
> >expensive way to get from A to B.
> >
> >California is planning to build a high speed rail line from San Diego to
> >San Francisco. A trip from LA to SF will take less than 2 1/2 hrs. You
> >could scarcely get to LAX, find a place to park, check-in, go through
> >security, board a plane, and wait for it to take off in that amount of
> >time. The trains will also help to relieve congestion on the freeways
> >and airports.
>
>
> Why do you think going to the train station, finding a place to park,
> checking in, going through security and getting on a train will be
> faster?

I'll answer your rhetorical question: Because the high speed rail
project has been well engineered. The trouble with the freeways and
airports is that they were designed for about 1/10 of the traffic that
they have now.

> As soon as somebody uncovers a plot to bomb a train we will be talking
> our shoes off at the train station. I also bet that 2 1/2 hours is a
> pipe dream that never really happens.

I think it will happen. It's a finite distance, and the speed of the
train is known. The track will be on a separate grade, so there's no
crossings to slow things down.

>Trains in the north east work
> well, as long as you are not going very far and light rail is a very
> successful way to renovate slums. At least close enough along the
> route to get to easily but far enough away so you don't hear the
> train.

Posted by Kurt Ullman on April 13, 2008, 9:03 am
In article


> I'll answer your rhetorical question: Because the high speed rail
> project has been well engineered. The trouble with the freeways and
> airports is that they were designed for about 1/10 of the traffic that
> they have now.

The well-engineered part is the problem. The Interstates have always
been publicized as being what is needed to keep traffic moving smoothly
for 20 years. Yet traffic tends to rise immeditaely to fill all that
empty space. Nature abhors a vacuum and motorists abhor a empty inch of
traffic lane at rush hour.

>
> > As soon as somebody uncovers a plot to bomb a train we will be talking
> > our shoes off at the train station. I also bet that 2 1/2 hours is a
> > pipe dream that never really happens.
>
> I think it will happen. It's a finite distance, and the speed of the
> train is known. The track will be on a separate grade, so there's no
> crossings to slow things down.

But that many more bridges or overpasses also increases the number of
things that can dynamited and do nasty things to the trains. Also much
more bang (so to speak) for the buck smashing around a train carrying
100s of passengers than a few tens of people spread out around on a
freeway.

Posted by hallerb@aol.com on April 13, 2008, 9:12 am
On Apr 12, 7:44=EF=BF=BDpm, gfretw...@aol.com wrote:
> On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 10:57:02 -0700, aspasia wrote:
> >> I generally fly first class and they treat me fine.
>
> >Apres toi, le deluge!
>
> >Aspasia
>
> A first class train ride will cost a lot more than a first class plane
> ride.
> The discount price on a train will be more than the discount price =EF=BF=
=BDon
> a plane and you will be in the cattle car for 3 days to get across the
> country. I'm sure Americans who think the microwave is too slow will
> be linng up for the train.

no a mag lev train can rival the speed of a aircraft. run with no
grade crossings etc.

it can be completely computer controlled with individual cars leaving
for different places continually........

like every hour 39B leaves for chicago with just 2 stops.

pay more for reservations or just show up and take next avaliable
spot.

all powered by electric for minimum pollution

speeds of 350 MPH have been achieved.

Posted by Not@home on April 13, 2008, 11:14 am


gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On Sat, 12 Apr 2008 10:57:02 -0700, aspasia wrote:
>
>>> I generally fly first class and they treat me fine.
>> Apres toi, le deluge!
>>
>> Aspasia
>
> A first class train ride will cost a lot more than a first class plane
> ride.
> The discount price on a train will be more than the discount price on
> a plane and you will be in the cattle car for 3 days to get across the
> country. I'm sure Americans who think the microwave is too slow will
> be linng up for the train.

Per Amtrak, a round trip from Cleveland to Chicago Union station is $118
and you start and end up downtown.

Per expedia, a tourist flight from Cleveland to Chicago O'hare is $137,
plus fees, and you start and end up in a field far removed from downtown.

Per expedia, the first class flight is $1102, from cowfield to cowfield,
so with either flight you have additional time and cost to get downtown.

The train is slower, but the seating and accommodations are superior to
any plane, including first class.

It is true that there are more expensive tickets on the train, such as
if you want a bedroom or suite (but none as expensive as a first class
airline ticket), but I think generally a train is a better bargain for
all but very long trips. And with fuel prices soaring and airlines
falling out of business, this should be even more true in the future.

So if I want to go to Chicago, I'll take the train. If I want to go to
San Diego, I'll fly, although there is something to be said for the
adventure of taking a transcontinental train, which is probably why the
Canadian transcontinental is consistently oversubscribed.

The main problem with train travel in this country is that routes are so
limited. In other countries, they have better train services, due no
doubt to their very high cost of gasoline and cars, and very limited
parking.

Posted by Kurt Ullman on April 13, 2008, 11:34 am

>
> Per expedia, the first class flight is $1102, from cowfield to cowfield,
> so with either flight you have additional time and cost to get downtown.

Most of the time on the outbound trip you are substituting a trip
from your cornfield to another for a trip from your cornfield to
downtown. So, I am not all that sure that trains save you anything on
that part. Although this is not always a viable alternative, probably a
comparison with flights to Midway (downtown) would be better.

>

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