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Re: Help-- Rim joist rotted! SQLit 06-22-2005
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Posted by SQLit on June 22, 2005, 10:55 am

> We're building a new deck, and yesterday I removed the old ledger board
from
> the old deck and to my horor, discovered that for years, water had been
> seeping between this board and the rim joist on the house, and the rim
joist
> is now badly rotted. In fact, there's about a 12-18" section that is all
> but not there now, once I poked many holes through it with my finger...
>
> So now I need to know how to go about replacing it, so I can continue on
> with the deck. I've googled for info without much luck. The little info
I
> found via google assumes that the rim joist is perpendicular to the floor
> joists, and that it's right over the foundation. In my case, it's
parallel
> to the floor joists (and on the gable end of the house), and since it's a
> split-entry house, there is a short (approx 5') wall between this joist
and
> the block foundation below.
>
> My questions are:
>
> a) do I have to replace this joist as a complete span, or can I cut it out
> and replace the damaged chunk? The posts dealing with the joists right
over
> the foundation imply you can just cut out the damaged section, but since
I'm
> over a wall, I wasn't sure if this was more structural. For what it's
> worth, the wall's top plate is only a single 2x4, not a doubled header
plate
> like you'd expect if it were load bearing.
>
> b) What, if anything, do I need to do to brace the house temporarilly
during
> this repair? As I have vinyl siding over "build rite", I can get to the
> framing reasonably easy from the outside, but both levels of the inside
are
> finished and would be a major problem to remove anything down to the
framing
> members. The damaged chunk isn't doing anything structurally now, but I
> want to make sure I don't have "the walls tumble down" if I remove a
> slightly bigger one...
>
> Any advice is greatly appreciated. I"d like to (at least start to) tackle
> this project today, so any info I can get ASAP would be wonderful.
>
> -Tim
>
> P.S. By the way, I'm pretty handy with repairs and with a hammer -- just
> never had to tackle anything of this nature before (and hopefully won't
> anytime soon after this!

Me thinks you need a pro to guide you.

I would only be guessing at a solution. I bet your going to be jacking the
house up to replace the rotted timber.



Posted by Doug Miller on June 22, 2005, 11:15 am
>
>Me thinks you need a pro to guide you.
>
>I would only be guessing at a solution. I bet your going to be jacking the
>house up to replace the rotted timber.

Concur with that - and suggest using treated lumber as the replacement, to
avoid a recurrence five years down the road.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

Posted by Tim Fischer on June 22, 2005, 11:51 am


> Me thinks you need a pro to guide you.
>
> I would only be guessing at a solution. I bet your going to be jacking
the
> house up to replace the rotted timber.

I'm not even sure what type of a pro you'd call for such a thing. And I
envision it to be very expensive, not so much because it's difficult, but
because it's labor intensive.

I'd be very open to hiring someone to come out and consult me and then let
me do the work, if I could find such a person. But we really don't have an
extra $2-3K in the budget right now to cover this little "surprise" and have
it fully done. We're building the new deck ourselves, and this would just
about double the cost of it.

Can anyone answer the following questions:

a) On the gable side of a split-entry house, to what degree are the framing
members load bearing? It would seem like if this was bearing major weight
that it would be resting on something a little more solid than a single 2x4
top plate (for what it's worth, the 2x4 is also rotted out and needs to be
replaced).

b) Is a 2x10" rim joist in this application a "spanning" member, or does it
simply rest on the wall below? That is, can I cut out a chunk and replace
it, or does the entire span (from side of the house to the center steel
support, presumably) need replacing?

c) Again in this application, can I safely remove a 2-3' chunk of rim joist
and replace it without jacking? There doen't seem to be many loads here on
the gable side -- there's absolutely no noticable sagging with the 1-2'
rotten chunk now... If I do need to jack, how what do I jack against? I'm
partially under a patio door, but I'd envision attaching a temporary
horizontal member to the framing studs of the house, and jacking between
that and the ground from the exterior? (Again, I'm parallel to the floor
joists, not perp to it).

d) Once again, my new deck will be supported by this member (actually, if
I'd just replace the damaged chunk, it would be replaced mostly by the old,
non-rotten portions of the original member, and just a 2-3' chunk of
replacement). So everything will need to be engineered so the deck will be
properly supported.

Rest assured I'm pretty good at knowing when I'm over my head -- but I"m
looking for specific details here. Upon hearing how it's done, I'm capable
of realizing if I'll need to call in the pros or not. But for now, I'm
simply asking "how would the pros do it"? I do appreciate the sentiments
that I should just call a pro, but now that we've got that covered twice
over, I'd appreciate it if all future replies can stick to the questions at
hand, and any other project specific details.

Thanks!
-Tim



Posted by DiezMon on June 22, 2005, 12:13 pm
You could call the city you're in and have an engineer come out to take a
look.

That way, you're paying someone to tell you how to fix it, not to DO the
fix.

Tim


>
>
> > Me thinks you need a pro to guide you.
> >
> > I would only be guessing at a solution. I bet your going to be jacking
> the
> > house up to replace the rotted timber.
>
> I'm not even sure what type of a pro you'd call for such a thing. And I
> envision it to be very expensive, not so much because it's difficult, but
> because it's labor intensive.
>
> I'd be very open to hiring someone to come out and consult me and then let
> me do the work, if I could find such a person. But we really don't have
an
> extra $2-3K in the budget right now to cover this little "surprise" and
have
> it fully done. We're building the new deck ourselves, and this would just
> about double the cost of it.
>
> Can anyone answer the following questions:
>
> a) On the gable side of a split-entry house, to what degree are the
framing
> members load bearing? It would seem like if this was bearing major weight
> that it would be resting on something a little more solid than a single
2x4
> top plate (for what it's worth, the 2x4 is also rotted out and needs to be
> replaced).
>
> b) Is a 2x10" rim joist in this application a "spanning" member, or does
it
> simply rest on the wall below? That is, can I cut out a chunk and replace
> it, or does the entire span (from side of the house to the center steel
> support, presumably) need replacing?
>
> c) Again in this application, can I safely remove a 2-3' chunk of rim
joist
> and replace it without jacking? There doen't seem to be many loads here
on
> the gable side -- there's absolutely no noticable sagging with the 1-2'
> rotten chunk now... If I do need to jack, how what do I jack against?
I'm
> partially under a patio door, but I'd envision attaching a temporary
> horizontal member to the framing studs of the house, and jacking between
> that and the ground from the exterior? (Again, I'm parallel to the floor
> joists, not perp to it).
>
> d) Once again, my new deck will be supported by this member (actually, if
> I'd just replace the damaged chunk, it would be replaced mostly by the
old,
> non-rotten portions of the original member, and just a 2-3' chunk of
> replacement). So everything will need to be engineered so the deck will
be
> properly supported.
>
> Rest assured I'm pretty good at knowing when I'm over my head -- but I"m
> looking for specific details here. Upon hearing how it's done, I'm
capable
> of realizing if I'll need to call in the pros or not. But for now, I'm
> simply asking "how would the pros do it"? I do appreciate the sentiments
> that I should just call a pro, but now that we've got that covered twice
> over, I'd appreciate it if all future replies can stick to the questions
at
> hand, and any other project specific details.
>
> Thanks!
> -Tim
>
>



Posted by JimL on June 22, 2005, 1:37 pm

Tim


There are some experienced professionals on this newsgroup. But
they can't work with your inadequate descriptions of your problem.

Post several pictures of the problem also showing the structural
details of your house and you will get some valuable advice from the
professionals.

JimL







wrote:

>
>
>> Me thinks you need a pro to guide you.
>>
>> I would only be guessing at a solution. I bet your going to be jacking
>the
>> house up to replace the rotted timber.
>
>I'm not even sure what type of a pro you'd call for such a thing. And I
>envision it to be very expensive, not so much because it's difficult, but
>because it's labor intensive.
>
>I'd be very open to hiring someone to come out and consult me and then let
>me do the work, if I could find such a person. But we really don't have an
>extra $2-3K in the budget right now to cover this little "surprise" and have
>it fully done. We're building the new deck ourselves, and this would just
>about double the cost of it.
>
>Can anyone answer the following questions:
>
>a) On the gable side of a split-entry house, to what degree are the framing
>members load bearing? It would seem like if this was bearing major weight
>that it would be resting on something a little more solid than a single 2x4
>top plate (for what it's worth, the 2x4 is also rotted out and needs to be
>replaced).
>
>b) Is a 2x10" rim joist in this application a "spanning" member, or does it
>simply rest on the wall below? That is, can I cut out a chunk and replace
>it, or does the entire span (from side of the house to the center steel
>support, presumably) need replacing?
>
>c) Again in this application, can I safely remove a 2-3' chunk of rim joist
>and replace it without jacking? There doen't seem to be many loads here on
>the gable side -- there's absolutely no noticable sagging with the 1-2'
>rotten chunk now... If I do need to jack, how what do I jack against? I'm
>partially under a patio door, but I'd envision attaching a temporary
>horizontal member to the framing studs of the house, and jacking between
>that and the ground from the exterior? (Again, I'm parallel to the floor
>joists, not perp to it).
>
>d) Once again, my new deck will be supported by this member (actually, if
>I'd just replace the damaged chunk, it would be replaced mostly by the old,
>non-rotten portions of the original member, and just a 2-3' chunk of
>replacement). So everything will need to be engineered so the deck will be
>properly supported.
>
>Rest assured I'm pretty good at knowing when I'm over my head -- but I"m
>looking for specific details here. Upon hearing how it's done, I'm capable
>of realizing if I'll need to call in the pros or not. But for now, I'm
>simply asking "how would the pros do it"? I do appreciate the sentiments
>that I should just call a pro, but now that we've got that covered twice
>over, I'd appreciate it if all future replies can stick to the questions at
>hand, and any other project specific details.
>
>Thanks!
>-Tim
>


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