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Re: Propane Generator and Transfer Switch

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Re: Propane Generator and Transfer Switch Dick Adams 09-28-2007
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Posted by Dick Adams on September 28, 2007, 10:34 pm

>I'm considering having a 16 kw generator installed and I'd like to know what
>to expect when the generator and transfer switch is installed and hooked
>up. For example to what is the main power coming from the transfer switch
>hooked up into my breaker panel? What happens to the breakers of the
>different circuits that selected for emergency operation. Do I give up any
>of the current open breaker spots I have. The Guardian unit I am looking at
>says it operates at 76 decibels. I don't know what equivalent noise level
>that is. At the moment I am planning to have it placed directly on the
>other side of the playroom wall as that is where the main breaker panel is
>located. I also have a suitable spot about 20 feet away from the house if
>the noise would be a problem. I'd like to be able to observe the process
>with some sort of understanding. Thanks for any input or other comments
>about the actual hooking up.

I live just west of Ballimer (Baltimore - the city that slurs).
We just experienced the first of the usual Fall-Winter power
outages. A few years ago, we had no electricity for 6 days.
the usual outages last 1 to 3 days. We were considering a
generator until we heard one up close. At 100 to 150 feet
they don't sound that loud, but if you are in the house,
you have trouble hearing what people are saying.

Dick

Posted by Smarty on September 28, 2007, 11:52 pm
I installed a Generac permanent generator with transfer switch a year ago
after facing two extended power outages here. The Generac design for the
transfer switch requires a dual breaker to be installed in your main panel
which passes power to the transfer switch. The transfer switch then
subdivides this feed into 12 circuits, each of which has its' own breaker in
the transfer switch panel. These 12 circuits are the ones were are supported
during a power outage, and are literally disconnected from their current 12
breakers in your main panel and connected into the corresponding 12 breakers
in your new transfer switch. You actually "recover" 12 breaker positions in
your main panel since the 12 breakers could be reused (assuming you have
enough total house capacity and panel capacity to do so). The feeds from
each of the 12 house circuits are attached to 12 conductors which Generac
supplies using wire nuts. The entire installation process is described in a
video which can be viewed on the web, or on a DVD which Generac also
provides.

The noise level of the Generac is not terribly loud, but similar to a lawn
mower / tractor of comparable capacity when running full load. The weekly
test mode for 12 minutes of run time runs unloaded at a lower noise level.
To those of us who have subsequently lived with the generator during an
outage, the sound of the generator is sweet music. It is the silence which
occurs when it is not running but needed that I would call deafening! I
would advise to simply put the generator away from the major sleeping areas
of the house, and non fret about it. The noise level inside the house is
totally moderate. My neighbors on both sides have Generacs, and there have
been literally several thousand sold in my area in the last year as a result
of a freak October ice storm which took out power for some people up to
nearly 3 weeks.

I would also suggest you seriously evaluate your total electrical demand
since 16KW is too much power for many homes unless you want to run air
conditioning, electric stove, or other big power users. The Generac smaller
models produce considerably more efficient and less expensive electricity
when used near their peak capacity, versus running a 16y KW generator at
half load. Not only do the operating costs drop, but the cost of the unit
itself is considerably less.

Good luck and let me know if I can help you further,
Smarty





panel.
>
>>I'm considering having a 16 kw generator installed and I'd like to know
>>what
>>to expect when the generator and transfer switch is installed and hooked
>>up. For example to what is the main power coming from the transfer switch
>>hooked up into my breaker panel? What happens to the breakers of the
>>different circuits that selected for emergency operation. Do I give up
>>any
>>of the current open breaker spots I have. The Guardian unit I am looking
>>at
>>says it operates at 76 decibels. I don't know what equivalent noise level
>>that is. At the moment I am planning to have it placed directly on the
>>other side of the playroom wall as that is where the main breaker panel is
>>located. I also have a suitable spot about 20 feet away from the house if
>>the noise would be a problem. I'd like to be able to observe the process
>>with some sort of understanding. Thanks for any input or other comments
>>about the actual hooking up.
>
> I live just west of Ballimer (Baltimore - the city that slurs).
> We just experienced the first of the usual Fall-Winter power
> outages. A few years ago, we had no electricity for 6 days.
> the usual outages last 1 to 3 days. We were considering a
> generator until we heard one up close. At 100 to 150 feet
> they don't sound that loud, but if you are in the house,
> you have trouble hearing what people are saying.
>
> Dick



Posted by Caesar Romano on September 29, 2007, 9:22 am
Re Re: Propane Generator and Transfer Switch:

>The noise level of the Generac is not terribly loud, but similar to a lawn
>mower / tractor of comparable capacity when running full load. The weekly
>test mode for 12 minutes of run time runs unloaded at a lower noise level.
>To those of us who have subsequently lived with the generator during an
>outage, the sound of the generator is sweet music. It is the silence which
>occurs when it is not running but needed that I would call deafening! I
>would advise to simply put the generator away from the major sleeping areas
>of the house, and non fret about it.

Good points and good advice. I might also suggest that if possible
build a small shed for the generator. The shed will lower the noise
level considerably. Note that I wrote "build". A small commercial shed
won't do unless you make a lot of modifications for ventilation.

When I installed my generator ( a loud cheap brand ) 15-years ago I
designed/built a small shed as it was cheaper and easier than having
to modify a commercial model. It works well to this day.

Posted by ransley on September 29, 2007, 11:44 am
> Re Re: Propane Generator and Transfer Switch:
>
> >The noise level of the Generac is not terribly loud, but similar to a lawn
> >mower / tractor of comparable capacity when running full load. The weekly
> >test mode for 12 minutes of run time runs unloaded at a lower noise level.
> >To those of us who have subsequently lived with the generator during an
> >outage, the sound of the generator is sweet music. It is the silence which
> >occurs when it is not running but needed that I would call deafening! I
> >would advise to simply put the generator away from the major sleeping areas
> >of the house, and non fret about it.
>
> Good points and good advice. I might also suggest that if possible
> build a small shed for the generator. The shed will lower the noise
> level considerably. Note that I wrote "build". A small commercial shed
> won't do unless you make a lot of modifications for ventilation.
>
> When I installed my generator ( a loud cheap brand ) 15-years ago I
> designed/built a small shed as it was cheaper and easier than having
> to modify a commercial model. It works well to this day.

Honda has some of the quietest units and publishes db ratings and
comparisons. 87 is alot and the low frequency of the sound travels
through walls, it rumbles as its a large motor. The lower the
frequency, the longer the wave and the more difficulty you have in
stopping it. You wont like it. Honda has portables you dont really
notice at 15ft or so, or be annoyed. You will have a monthly test mode
which will consume a noticable amount of gas. If outages are rare
consider a portable you wheel out and plug into a transfer swtch and
manualy control. How often does the power go out and for how long, If
its once a year for a few hours a portable is best, like a Tri Fuel
Honda. The Generac is a 3600 rpm unit with maybe 2-3000 hr life, An
inverter series Honda or yamaha run easy at 1600-1800 rpm can easily
last 10,000 hours, rpm is load dependant unlike what you are looking
at, unless their design has changed.


Posted by M Q on September 29, 2007, 12:52 pm


ransley wrote:

...
> Honda. The Generac is a 3600 rpm unit with maybe 2-3000 hr life, An
> inverter series Honda or yamaha run easy at 1600-1800 rpm can easily
> last 10,000 hours, rpm is load dependant unlike what you are looking
> at, unless their design has changed.
>

" ... rpm is load dependent ... "

Should only be slightly. Exactly what do you mean?


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