Home Page link

Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection

Home| Search | About
Login Password
Register Now! Lost Password?

Home Repair - - If it ain't broken, don't fix it. Otherwise look here. 

Page 1 of 2       1 2 > last >> Bookmark this page:  YahooMyWeb Yahoo!  Google Google  Windows Live Favorites Windows Live  del.icio.us del.icio.us  digg digg  Add to Netscape Netscape
Subject Author Date
Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection Jim Redelfs 06-06-2008
If you were  Registered and logged in, you could reply and use other advanced thread options
Posted by Jim Redelfs on June 6, 2008, 2:53 am
letterman@invalid.com wrote:

> Every summer I lose at least one modem from lightning
> several answering machines and cordless phones die
> too. In rural areas it seems these surges are worse

I maintained a LOT of rural telephone infrastructure during my momentous
career with Northwestern Bell Telephone Company -=> US WEST -=> Qwest.

(We used to call it "plant" instead of "infrastructure" but, probably,
someone didn't KNOW what that meant or thought it meant PLANTS that grow
and were embarrassed when they finally ASKED what it meant, so we can't
call it PLANT anymore lest someone feel embarrassed that they, too,
don't know what it means in this context.)

Over the years I worked on a lot of farms and acreages with numerous,
powered outbuildings on a private distribution system.

You probably have an insufficient and likely defective grounding system
on your premise. A call to a qualified electrician might be worth the
cost.

All outbuildings should be properly grounded AT the power entrance to
each building. The system should be so "earthed" at the distribution
pole.

If your mobile home was properly grounded and anchored when first placed
on its site, including wiring done by a qualified electrician, the
superstructure of the manufactured home, including the main chassis
frame and its properly welded outriggers, should provide sufficient low
resistance bonding to earth for use by any protection device.

Simply re-making all existing ground connections around the place might
solve the problem without actually FINDING the precise location.

The OPs give good advise. Good luck.
--
:)
JR

Plumbing 468x60
Posted by on June 6, 2008, 4:50 am
>
> =A0letter...@invalid.com wrote:
> > Every summer I lose at least one modem from lightning
> > several answering machines and cordless phones die
> > too. =A0In rural areas it seems these surges are worse
>
> I maintained a LOT of rural telephone infrastructure during my momentous
> career with Northwestern Bell Telephone Company -=3D> US WEST -=3D> Qwest.=

>
> (We used to call it "plant" instead of "infrastructure" but, probably,
> someone didn't KNOW what that meant or thought it meant PLANTS that grow
> and were embarrassed when they finally ASKED what it meant, so we can't
> call it PLANT anymore lest someone feel embarrassed that they, too,
> don't know what it means in this context.)
>
> Over the years I worked on a lot of farms and acreages with numerous,
> powered outbuildings on a private distribution system.
>
> You probably have an insufficient and likely defective grounding system
> on your premise. =A0A call to a qualified electrician might be worth the
> cost.


Since his problem seems to be centered on the phone line, I'd start by
calling the phone company. They should come out to check the
grounding and surge protection on the phone line for free. It's
possible it's defective or not there.





>
> All outbuildings should be properly grounded AT the power entrance to
> each building. =A0The system should be so "earthed" at the distribution
> pole.
>
> If your mobile home was properly grounded and anchored when first placed
> on its site, including wiring done by a qualified electrician, the
> superstructure of the manufactured home, including the main chassis
> frame and its properly welded outriggers, should provide sufficient low
> resistance bonding to earth for use by any protection device.
>
> Simply re-making all existing ground connections around the place might
> solve the problem without actually FINDING the precise location.
>
> The OPs give good advise. =A0Good luck.
> --
> =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 :)
> JR


Posted by Jim Redelfs on June 6, 2008, 11:11 am
In article
trader4@optonline.net wrote:

> Since his problem seems to be centered on the phone line, I'd start by
> calling the phone company. They should come out to check the
> grounding and surge protection on the phone line for free.

It's not "free", per se. It's already been paid.

Also, your use of the word "should" is right on. It's a crap shoot if
the hapless subscriber can talk the repair line answerer into
dispatching a service technician on a WORKING line.

If the telco tech finds NO trouble on THEIR line, and the service is NOT
covered by an inside maintenance plan (subscription feature), a
significant (~$75) charge could apply.

> It's possible it's defective or not there.

That goes without saying. (Anything is possible.)

I encountered the occasional ~20-year-old service where the system was
NEVER bonded.

There was a hand-coil of solid ground wire to MAKE the run but it had
never been completed. This was typical of a new house that was
"pre-wired" by the phone company BEFORE the plumbing or electric had
been installed. One can assume that the technician that left the
service UNgrounded had some intention to return to finish the job. He
never made it back. I know the feeling. I occasionally fixed them. Of
course, I never revealed my discovery to the property owner.

In today's "legacy" (incumbent) telephone world, there is NO "going
back" to finish a job.

IF telephone plant gets NO respect at all, its grounds get even less.

Telephone companies have been around only slightly fewer years than
railroads. (132 years and counting)

They had all their liabilities covered YEARS before there was any talk
of divestiture and breaking-up the Bell System monopoly. They will NOT
replace customer equipment.

It has been my experience that an in-line suppressor circuit caused a
dial-up connection to degrade and slow down. Beware. Good luck.
--
:)
JR

Posted by w_tom on June 6, 2008, 7:18 pm
On Jun 6, 4:24 pm, letter...@invalid.com wrote:
> After reading all the replies on here yesterday, I called the
> Telephone company. They told me that there is nothing they can do
> about lightning damage to electronic devices connected to their line,
> and suggested I buy surge protectors. When I told them that I do not
> believe I have an adequate ground, they said that if they installed
> the the line, it was done right. I explained the method used to
> ground it and told them that I do not consider this adaquate.
>
> They said they would come to check, but if they do not find a problem,
> I would have to pay a minimum $50 fee. If they did find a problem in
> MY WIRING, I'd also be charged. If however they found a problem on
> THEIR END of the wiring, there would be no charge.

Appalling are the large number of Americans who don't know how
electricity works. Talking to the telco phone banks is like asking an
English major why a light bulb works. They don't know. Only way to
get problems solved is to get the lineman - the only telco service
people who know how electricity works. You can spend hours explaining
the problem to a phone droid. The lineman takes a look and solves it
in minutes.

This problem is so acute that Verizon recently created a VP of
customer service.

If you did not have earthing, then you had no surge protection. AND
if all incoming utilities are not earthed to the same point (directly
or via a protector), then damage will still result. Nobody is
'required' to solve surge damage due to multiple earth ground rods.
However one utility discusses the problem AND solutions in "Preventing
Damage Due to Ground Potential Difference" at:
http://www.cinergy.com/surge/ttip08.htm

Bottom line: you (the homeowner) is responsible for providing proper
earthing. If you don't provide sufficient earthing, then inadequate
earthing by each utility may be installed. Any utility wire in any
cable that enters without a connection to earth ground can earth
lightning, destructively, through appliances. One common path to
earth is incoming on AC hot (black) wires, and destructively to earth
via telephone appliances and that telco installed 'whole house'
protector. All incoming wires must connect to that same earthing
electrode - the single point earth ground.

This is America. The homeowner is ultimately responsible for
getting all utilities to properly earth. How good is that earthing
(meaning how good is that protection)? Well, what single point
earthing electrode(s) did you install?

Posted by w_tom on June 7, 2008, 10:31 pm
> probably too late, but add your new ground rod (a foot or
> two away from existing rod) and separate #8 to the existing
> grounding means, more is better.

Code says the second ground rod must be located at least 6 feet
away.

As long as a wire from NID (demarc) to earth ground rod is
sufficient gauge (14 or 10 AWG), then increasing wire gauge does
little to create better earthing. Again, the word is impedance.
Thicker wire means lower resistance; not lower impedance. Lower
impedance is more important. Lower impedance is best created by
making that earthing connection shorter, no sharp bends, no splices,
etc. Increasing wire gauge provides minimal if any significant
improvement. Shorter wire length is more important than a thicker
wire.

Better protection means a shorter connection to earth and a longer
distance to the protected appliance.

Page 1 of 2       1 2 > last >>
Similar ThreadsPosted
Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection June 5, 2008, 7:53 am
Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection June 5, 2008, 8:15 am
Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection June 6, 2008, 9:00 am
Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection June 7, 2008, 10:08 pm
Re: Whole house phoneline surge protection June 29, 2008, 11:16 pm
What Type Of Surge Protection House Circuit Breaker ? August 3, 2005, 2:34 pm
Does as GFCI give you some surge protection? March 27, 2007, 7:19 am
point of use surge protection question May 21, 2008, 7:02 pm
Whole house surge suppressor October 24, 2005, 5:58 pm
Whole house surge protector? July 6, 2005, 8:50 am

Contact Us | Privacy Policy

XML SitemapXML Sitemap