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Home Repair - - If it ain't broken, don't fix it. Otherwise look here.
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Posted by Gunn on August 22, 2006, 10:17 am
Our very old deep well jet pump is dying. It will never shut off.
Plumber came and told us the impellers are shot from the ancient motor.
It is reading a pressure of 42psi, but it not enough to cutoff, so it
runs and runs.
He quoted $1500 to replace it. I'm going to do it myself. The pump is
easily accessible with two galvanized pipes coming from the well to it,
and one 3/4" output to the house water supply (bladder tank). But even
being galvanized, I'm betting they are going to be a bear to remove.
So in planning ahead (since we will have no water once I begin!), I'm
considering just cutting the pipes as close the motor as possible with
either a reciprocating saw, or a compressed air metal cutting wheel
tool I have. The reciprocating saw with metal blade seems the better
choice...?
I'm wondering if this is a good idea, and if it is possible to connect
PVC to galvanized pipe...that has no threads? PVC compression fittings
(compression x MIPS) seem like a good idea, but those will only work if
I have threads. Is there something else I can use?
Thanks,
Tom
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Posted by Don on August 22, 2006, 11:38 am
> Our very old deep well jet pump is dying. It will never shut off.
> Plumber came and told us the impellers are shot from the ancient motor.
> It is reading a pressure of 42psi, but it not enough to cutoff, so it
> runs and runs.
>
> He quoted $1500 to replace it. I'm going to do it myself. The pump is
> easily accessible with two galvanized pipes coming from the well to it,
> and one 3/4" output to the house water supply (bladder tank). But even
> being galvanized, I'm betting they are going to be a bear to remove.
>
> So in planning ahead (since we will have no water once I begin!), I'm
> considering just cutting the pipes as close the motor as possible with
> either a reciprocating saw, or a compressed air metal cutting wheel
> tool I have. The reciprocating saw with metal blade seems the better
> choice...?
>
> I'm wondering if this is a good idea, and if it is possible to connect
> PVC to galvanized pipe...that has no threads? PVC compression fittings
> (compression x MIPS) seem like a good idea, but those will only work if
> I have threads. Is there something else I can use?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tom
>
iVe seen them use plastic pipe with a metal cable to pull the pumps weight.
lighter and easier.
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Posted by Chris Lewis on August 22, 2006, 3:42 pm
>
> > Our very old deep well jet pump is dying. It will never shut off.
> > Plumber came and told us the impellers are shot from the ancient motor.
> > It is reading a pressure of 42psi, but it not enough to cutoff, so it
> > runs and runs.
> >
> > He quoted $1500 to replace it. I'm going to do it myself. The pump is
> > easily accessible with two galvanized pipes coming from the well to it,
> > and one 3/4" output to the house water supply (bladder tank). But even
> > being galvanized, I'm betting they are going to be a bear to remove.
> >
> > So in planning ahead (since we will have no water once I begin!), I'm
> > considering just cutting the pipes as close the motor as possible with
> > either a reciprocating saw, or a compressed air metal cutting wheel
> > tool I have. The reciprocating saw with metal blade seems the better
> > choice...?
> >
> > I'm wondering if this is a good idea, and if it is possible to connect
> > PVC to galvanized pipe...that has no threads? PVC compression fittings
> > (compression x MIPS) seem like a good idea, but those will only work if
> > I have threads. Is there something else I can use?
> iVe seen them use plastic pipe with a metal cable to pull the pumps weight.
> lighter and easier.
This is at the jet pump topside. Not down the well for a submersible.
Submersibles usually have one PVC line, the power cable, and a
nylon rope for security.
I swapped my jet pump once because the impeller self-destructed.
Same HP and all. The brand new jet pump didn't produce anywhere near
as much water as the old did. And I couldn't afford converting it
to submersible at the time.
So, I realized that my very old cast iron Gould pump was a vastly
better unit than the modern plastic ones, and that buying impellers
for the Gould is easy.
So, to make a long story short..., I realized that if I had simply
gone ahead and pulled the four bolts apart splitting the pump
chamber, replaced the impeller, and rebolted it back together,
I could have repaired the thing in about 30 minutes for a grand
total of $20 in parts.
[I bought a new impeller and a seal for the pump chamber. As it
turned out, I didn't need to replace the seal. The old one was
still in good condition, and CLR cleaned things up enough so that
I could reseal it. If I had replaced the seal, I'd probably have
had leaks until it properly seated.]
Instead, I had bought a new pump (for > $200). Installed it, big
fight with the lines. Didn't like it. Bought the parts for the old
one, put the new impeller in, removed the old pump (big fight with the
lines) and reinstalled the old pump (another fight with the lines)
- whole process took about a week.
Fortunately HD took the new pump back for a full refund.
Return cashier: "it's used!", Guy from plumbing isle: "Well, it
didn't do the job, did it? Give him his money back.".
I've learned my lesson. Try replacing the impeller. You shouldn't
even have to pull the lines off.
If the motor and seals are good, it's a lot easier to repair the
pump in place.
If, when you pull the thing apart, the impeller looks in perfect
condition, your problem is that the injector at the bottom of the
well is shot. I had that happen - same symptoms as yours.
[When my impeller broke, the motor jammed and stalled.]
One of the cast iron nipples at the bottom had rusted and blown out
(and was so heavily rusted into the cast iron injector it couldn't
be removed). You can buy _just_ the injector... Doesn't have to be
the same make of pump. I replaced the old cast iron one with a plastic
injector from a "modern" plastic pump.
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
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Posted by on August 22, 2006, 3:48 pm
Its not a good idea to hook PVC to unthreaded galvanized piping.
Have you thought about just replacing the motor and rotary assembly
since nothing seems to be wrong with the casing?
But there seems to be more wrong that could be wrong. I need a little
more info for a better understanding. You say that the impeller is
shot from the "ancient motor" but that doesn't really make sense. It
could be shot from many different things, but the constant running
would cause wear on it for sure. How long has it been constantly
running? The low pressure could also be several things, from a bad
tank, to a clogged jet.
What kind of pump and motor are on it now?
Gunn wrote:
> Our very old deep well jet pump is dying. It will never shut off.
> Plumber came and told us the impellers are shot from the ancient motor.
> It is reading a pressure of 42psi, but it not enough to cutoff, so it
> runs and runs.
>
> He quoted $1500 to replace it. I'm going to do it myself. The pump is
> easily accessible with two galvanized pipes coming from the well to it,
> and one 3/4" output to the house water supply (bladder tank). But even
> being galvanized, I'm betting they are going to be a bear to remove.
>
> So in planning ahead (since we will have no water once I begin!), I'm
> considering just cutting the pipes as close the motor as possible with
> either a reciprocating saw, or a compressed air metal cutting wheel
> tool I have. The reciprocating saw with metal blade seems the better
> choice...?
>
> I'm wondering if this is a good idea, and if it is possible to connect
> PVC to galvanized pipe...that has no threads? PVC compression fittings
> (compression x MIPS) seem like a good idea, but those will only work if
> I have threads. Is there something else I can use?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tom
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Posted by Gunn on August 24, 2006, 8:58 am
FloridaPumpService@gmail.com wrote:
> Its not a good idea to hook PVC to unthreaded galvanized piping.
>
> Have you thought about just replacing the motor and rotary assembly
> since nothing seems to be wrong with the casing?
>
> But there seems to be more wrong that could be wrong. I need a little
> more info for a better understanding. You say that the impeller is
> shot from the "ancient motor" but that doesn't really make sense. It
> could be shot from many different things, but the constant running
> would cause wear on it for sure. How long has it been constantly
> running? The low pressure could also be several things, from a bad
> tank, to a clogged jet.
>
> What kind of pump and motor are on it now?
>From getting a grip on what I'm up against, I am hopeful that I can cut
through the two galvanized pipe very near the pump. The current pipes
seem to be flanged to the pump, and the bolts holding the bracket that
presses the flange to the motor are -very- rusted. Then, after the
pipes are cut, I hope I can get a pipe wrench to remove the straight
section to the elbow, and then use threaded PVC into the elbow, back to
the pump.
The new pump I just purchased has measurements that are very close to
the locations of the current pipes, so it hopefully won't be too bad of
a retrofit.
The current pump is a Century. From the looks of it, I'm betting its
original...1966. I haven't been able to find any info on that brand, so
replacing the impeller is probably a long shot.
The pump is 1/2HP and runs for about 15-20 minutes each time it needs
to come on before cyling off. We've lived in the house for 3 years now
and that's been the norm. Since it starting on the fritz this past
weekend, it would run constantly. Showing 42psi on the pump gauge. We
started using the circuit breaker to turn it on/off when we needed it,
so we could get by before this weekend when i can replace it. Just
purchased a new 1HP so we won't have to hear it run for very long in
the house...
Last night, I found directions for the pressure switch (not as old as
the pump) lying in the crawl space, and turned the cut-off pressure on
the pressure switch down. I think this has made the pump cut off
reliably again. Since I have done that, all night and this morning, the
pump will kick on, and go off as usual. The pump gauge is now showing
about 39psi.
So would that still point to bad impellers in the pump? I'm praying its
not the ejector assembly. I have no idea where the well is! The pipes
come up from dirt in the crawl space of the house. So I assume they go
down under the frost line (21" here) and turn to go outside the
house....somewhere. It's not exposed.
Thanks for the responses.
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