Smoke detectors for the elderly - Page 13

> On Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:27:35 -0400, "Robert Green"

> >I was at an elderly friend's house the other day when the smoke alarm

> >off. It was quite loud and I reacted instantly to the noise. My friend,

> >former Army marksman in his 70's, who's suffering from profound high
> >frequency hearing loss, heard nothing!!!
> >Then I started looking around for alarms that used lower frequency

> >but the only thing I could find were specially converted smoke detectors
> >that cost $300!!!!
> >I'm wondering why COTS alarms operate at such a high sound frequency,

> They do? I have an AC smoke alarm and I've had a couple battery ones,
> and they seem to be mid-range. (I've played the piano for 50 years,
> but still have little idea what note they are, or even what octave,
> but they still seem midrange. I'll guess, middle C. The nearby A is
> 440, so C must be 500 to 550 cps.)

> It sounds like a metallic kazoo, or a trombone at its mid-pitch.

> >especially when it's well known that older adults lose their high

> >hearing first. I have been thinking of just unsoldering the Sonalert
> >sounders in low priced alarms and replacing them with lower frequency

> Have they switched to little, high frequency sonalerts. They used to
> use ones as big as demitasse coffe cup. Bigger than that. More like a
> tea cup at a Chinese restaurant. They don't use that anymore? The
> bigger they are, the lower the pitch, right?

> I would say to look for old ones, but one of the two styles of smoke
> detector doesn't work well after it is old, they say. Doesn't the
> other kind still work well when it is old? Which is which?

> If you look at mouser.com I believe they sell a wide range of
> sonalerts and may give frequencies and probalby give specs. Best to
> use a high-speed connection becauase last I looked two years ago,
> every search dl's a pdf rep of the page in the catalog. So it takes a
> few seconds even with lo-speed dsl. But if they sell something, it
> seems they have every model of it, by more than one maker.

> Well, they don't seem to use pdf anymore, and it loads much quicker
> http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=sonalert but there
> don't seem to be pictures on this page, plus you will have to click on
> data sheet for specs.

> >Does anyone know of a *reasonably* priced smoke detector whose sounder is
> >audible to people with high frequency hearing loss? I'd like to buy a
> >couple of such detectors for him, but the price on the only unit I've

> >would bring the bill to over $1200 for four detectors, and that's just
> >unreasonable. I know what goes into making a smoke detector and 10x the
> >cost of the parts still wouldn't bring the price that high.

> P&M, because you're being nice to an old person.

>> On Sat, 3 Oct 2009 11:27:35 -0400, "Robert Green"

>> >I was at an elderly friend's house the other day when the smoke alarm

>went

>> >off. It was quite loud and I reacted instantly to the noise. My friend,

>a

>> >former Army marksman in his 70's, who's suffering from profound high
>> >frequency hearing loss, heard nothing!!!
>> >Then I started looking around for alarms that used lower frequency

>sounders

>> >but the only thing I could find were specially converted smoke detectors
>> >that cost $300!!!!
>> >I'm wondering why COTS alarms operate at such a high sound frequency,

>> They do? I have an AC smoke alarm and I've had a couple battery ones,
>> and they seem to be mid-range. (I've played the piano for 50 years,
>> but still have little idea what note they are, or even what octave,
>> but they still seem midrange. I'll guess, middle C. The nearby A is
>> 440, so C must be 500 to 550 cps.)

>I believe that the frequencies used by current smokes are in the 3000Hz
>range. However, there seems to be quite a difference between battery and
>line-powered smokes and the tones they create.

>> It sounds like a metallic kazoo, or a trombone at its mid-pitch.

>> >especially when it's well known that older adults lose their high

>frequency

>> >hearing first. I have been thinking of just unsoldering the Sonalert
>> >sounders in low priced alarms and replacing them with lower frequency

<SNIP from here to edit for space and concentrate on line-vs-battery point>

>> If you look at mouser.com I believe they sell a wide range of
>> sonalerts and may give frequencies and probalby give specs. Best to
>> use a high-speed connection becauase last I looked two years ago,
>> every search dl's a pdf rep of the page in the catalog. So it takes a
>> few seconds even with lo-speed dsl. But if they sell something, it
>> seems they have every model of it, by more than one maker.

>I thought of that, but I also didn't want to get into any wrongful death
>suit or run afoul of some obscure federal regulation that makes it illegal
>to modify an alarm. There's no telling whether the extra current draw might
>somehow affect the unit's detection capabilities.

>My AC smoke alarm specifically says not to make changes to it, but I
>connected a relay coil across the buzzer, and I used the contacts as
>part of my burglar/fire alarm system, first to set off the alarm,
>steady instead of wailing, and soon it will notify a monitoring
>service.
>If I have messed up the alarm and I die in a fire, I have in my will
>that my estate should sue me.

> I was at an elderly friend's house the other day when the smoke alarm went
> off. It was quite loud and I reacted instantly to the noise. My friend, a
> former Army marksman in his 70's, who's suffering from profound high
> frequency hearing loss, heard nothing!!!
>
> Then I started looking around for alarms that used lower frequency sounders
> but the only thing I could find were specially converted smoke detectors
> that cost $300!!!!
>
> I'm wondering why COTS alarms operate at such a high sound frequency,
> especially when it's well known that older adults lose their high frequency
> hearing first. I have been thinking of just unsoldering the Sonalert
> sounders in low priced alarms and replacing them with lower frequency
> sounders, but that could compromise the detector's ability to sense smoke if
> the replacement sounder has sufficiently different electrical
> characteristics.
>
> Does anyone know of a *reasonably* priced smoke detector whose sounder is
> audible to people with high frequency hearing loss? I'd like to buy a
> couple of such detectors for him, but the price on the only unit I've found
> would bring the bill to over $1200 for four detectors, and that's just
> unreasonable. I know what goes into making a smoke detector and 10x the
> cost of the parts still wouldn't bring the price that high.
>
> The idea that smokes use sounders that can't be heard by a lot of elderly
> people seems pretty unreasonable to me as well.
>
> Surely someone out there makes a smoke detector or combo smoke/CO detector
> (even better) that makes a sound people with typical hearing loss could hear
> a little better.
>
> BTW, we can skip flashing light smoke detectors. BT, DT, GTS! He's got a
> phone ringer/flasher that he never hears or sees. The unit's flasher can't
> really be seen in daytime easily and the electronic ringer again uses a tone
> in the 5000Hz and above range and is inaudible to him. FWIW, based on some
> simple tests I did with CoolEdit, a PC program that allows you to create any
> audible tone, he can hear most stuff below 4000Hz. Yes he has a hearing aid
> but no, he does not sleep with it in.
>
> Thanks in advance for your help.
>
> --
> Bobby G.
>
>