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Wiring GFCI help The dude 09-06-2008
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Posted by The dude on September 6, 2008, 12:29 am


I have a 30+ year old house.
I want to add a GFCI near the kitchen sink

This is what I have to work with
From the breaker box

Red - hot breaker 1
Black - hot breaker 2
White - neutral

Both breakers share the same neutral - they are chained together through
4 outlets

Red Outlet 1 (needs GFCI)
Red Outlet 2 (needs GFCI)
Black Outlet 3 (needs nothing)
Black Outlet 4 (needs nothing)

I tried to install the GFCI in outlet 1, but since it just constantly trips.
When I isolated the white from breaker 2 and was just using breaker 1,
it was ok.

Any suggestions??

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Posted by Mikepier on September 6, 2008, 4:30 am


> I have a 30+ year old house.
> I want to add a GFCI near the kitchen sink
>
> This is what I have to work with
> =A0From the breaker box
>
> Red - hot breaker 1
> Black - hot breaker 2
> White - neutral
>
> Both breakers share the same neutral - they are chained together through
> 4 outlets
>
> Red Outlet 1 (needs GFCI)
> Red Outlet 2 (needs GFCI)
> Black Outlet 3 (needs nothing)
> Black Outlet 4 (needs nothing)
>
> I tried to install the GFCI in outlet 1, but since it just constantly tri=
ps.
> When I isolated the white from breaker 2 and was just using breaker 1,
> it was ok.
>
> Any suggestions??


The problem is on the "Load" side of the GFI outlet. You attached the
red and neutral going to the next outlet, however the neutral is also
feeding the #3 &4 outlets. Since only the nuetral is GFI Protected,
but not the black wire, it senses a current imbalance and trips. There
are 2 ways to correct this.
1) Run a seperate neutral wire from outlet #1 to outlet #2 ( probably
hard to do if walls are closed) Or maybe easier:
2) Connect GFI on outlet #1, but nothing on Load side, and connect
another GFI on outlet #2 again with nothing on load side. This leaves
the black circuit by itself.

Posted by The dude on September 6, 2008, 9:44 am


Mikepier wrote:
>> I have a 30+ year old house.
>> I want to add a GFCI near the kitchen sink
>>
>> This is what I have to work with
>> From the breaker box
>>
>> Red - hot breaker 1
>> Black - hot breaker 2
>> White - neutral
>>
>> Both breakers share the same neutral - they are chained together through
>> 4 outlets
>>
>> Red Outlet 1 (needs GFCI)
>> Red Outlet 2 (needs GFCI)
>> Black Outlet 3 (needs nothing)
>> Black Outlet 4 (needs nothing)
>>
>> I tried to install the GFCI in outlet 1, but since it just constantly trips.
>> When I isolated the white from breaker 2 and was just using breaker 1,
>> it was ok.
>>
>> Any suggestions??
>
>
> The problem is on the "Load" side of the GFI outlet. You attached the
> red and neutral going to the next outlet, however the neutral is also
> feeding the #3 &4 outlets. Since only the nuetral is GFI Protected,
> but not the black wire, it senses a current imbalance and trips. There
> are 2 ways to correct this.
> 1) Run a seperate neutral wire from outlet #1 to outlet #2 ( probably
> hard to do if walls are closed) Or maybe easier:
> 2) Connect GFI on outlet #1, but nothing on Load side, and connect
> another GFI on outlet #2 again with nothing on load side. This leaves
> the black circuit by itself.

I cannot run a second neutral wire.

So I just need to buy another GFCI for #2.
What do you mean by not using the load side?

Posted by on September 6, 2008, 9:55 am


> Mikepier wrote:
> >> I have a 30+ year old house.
> >> I want to add a GFCI near the kitchen sink
>
> >> This is what I have to work with
> >> =A0From the breaker box
>
> >> Red - hot breaker 1
> >> Black - hot breaker 2
> >> White - neutral
>
> >> Both breakers share the same neutral - they are chained together throu=
gh
> >> 4 outlets
>
> >> Red Outlet 1 (needs GFCI)
> >> Red Outlet 2 (needs GFCI)
> >> Black Outlet 3 (needs nothing)
> >> Black Outlet 4 (needs nothing)
>
> >> I tried to install the GFCI in outlet 1, but since it just constantly =
trips.
> >> When I isolated the white from breaker 2 and was just using breaker 1,
> >> it was ok.
>
> >> Any suggestions??
>
> > The problem is on the "Load" side of the GFI outlet. You =A0attached th=
e
> > red and neutral going to the next outlet, however the neutral is also
> > feeding the #3 &4 outlets. Since only the nuetral =A0is GFI Protected,
> > but not the black wire, it senses a current imbalance and trips. There
> > are 2 ways to correct this.
> > 1) Run a seperate neutral wire from outlet #1 to outlet #2 ( probably
> > hard to do if walls are closed) Or maybe easier:
> > 2) Connect GFI on outlet #1, but nothing on Load side, =A0and connect
> > another GFI on outlet #2 again with nothing on load side. This leaves
> > the black circuit by itself.
>
> I cannot run a second neutral wire.
>
> So I just need to buy another GFCI for #2.
> What do you mean by not using the load side?- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -


The load side of a GFCI is used when you want that GFCI to not only
protect that outlet, but also other outlets. The other outlets are
connected to the load side of the one GFCI.

The easiest solution to your Edison circuit problem is to just use two
GFCIs in the two outlets and NOT use the load side.

Posted by The dude on September 6, 2008, 9:58 am


trader4@optonline.net wrote:
>> Mikepier wrote:
>>>> I have a 30+ year old house.
>>>> I want to add a GFCI near the kitchen sink
>>>> This is what I have to work with
>>>> From the breaker box
>>>> Red - hot breaker 1
>>>> Black - hot breaker 2
>>>> White - neutral
>>>> Both breakers share the same neutral - they are chained together through
>>>> 4 outlets
>>>> Red Outlet 1 (needs GFCI)
>>>> Red Outlet 2 (needs GFCI)
>>>> Black Outlet 3 (needs nothing)
>>>> Black Outlet 4 (needs nothing)
>>>> I tried to install the GFCI in outlet 1, but since it just constantly trips.
>>>> When I isolated the white from breaker 2 and was just using breaker 1,
>>>> it was ok.
>>>> Any suggestions??
>>> The problem is on the "Load" side of the GFI outlet. You attached the
>>> red and neutral going to the next outlet, however the neutral is also
>>> feeding the #3 &4 outlets. Since only the nuetral is GFI Protected,
>>> but not the black wire, it senses a current imbalance and trips. There
>>> are 2 ways to correct this.
>>> 1) Run a seperate neutral wire from outlet #1 to outlet #2 ( probably
>>> hard to do if walls are closed) Or maybe easier:
>>> 2) Connect GFI on outlet #1, but nothing on Load side, and connect
>>> another GFI on outlet #2 again with nothing on load side. This leaves
>>> the black circuit by itself.
>> I cannot run a second neutral wire.
>>
>> So I just need to buy another GFCI for #2.
>> What do you mean by not using the load side?- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>
> The load side of a GFCI is used when you want that GFCI to not only
> protect that outlet, but also other outlets. The other outlets are
> connected to the load side of the one GFCI.
>
> The easiest solution to your Edison circuit problem is to just use two
> GFCIs in the two outlets and NOT use the load side.

OK

I see now.

Thanks

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