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Posted by Jeff Liebermann on October 13, 2009, 10:37 pm
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 18:12:27 -0700 (PDT), "hr(bob) hofmann@att.net"
>I would replace them if they are under 1.3 V.
See:
<http://www.powerstream.com/AA-tests.htm>
If you look at the 4th graph (100ma discharge curve), the battery
still has plenty of life left at 1.3VDC and hits the knee at about 1.1
volts. (I'm assuming that a C cell has a similar discharge curve). My
tinkering with various designs and contrivances have found that many
devices will operate somewhat below 1.0VDC/cell. It's just that the
battery is well down the knee of the curve at 1.0V and simply goes
instantly flat. I've run AM/FM/SW radios with one cell jumpered and
the radio still works.
I'll stay with my 1.1VDC/cell recommendation for alkaline cells.
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
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Posted by Dennis M on October 13, 2009, 9:19 pm
>On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 18:22:09 -0500, dennism3@dennism3.invalid (Dennis
>M) wrote:
>>I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with wireless doorbells.
>Ummm... yes.
>>The
>>last couple of days mine has been ringing a couple of times on its own (no,
>>it isn't a pre-Halloween prank).
>Any particular maker and model number? Actually, what I would like is
>the FCC ID number from either the remote or the receiver so I can
>lookup the frequency. It's usually 418MHz(EU), 433.925Mhz, 315MHz,
>320MHz, 335MHz, 350MHz, 2400Mhz, etc. The frequency might also be
>inscribed on the device somewhere.
It is a Heath/Zenith Wireless Mechanical Battery Operated Chime,
manufactured by Desa Specialty Products of Bowling Green, Ky.
On the back the only thing that looks like a model number is "TR-6505-RX."
For some reason it also says "Canada: 3984 104 559A." Unfortunately, I
threw the original packaging it came in away.
But luckily I kept the manual. Some relevant excerpts:
"In typical use, aklaline batteries will last up to 2 1/2 years"
"Troubleshooting: Low battery indicator: When the push button designated
for the "Ding-Dong" tone is pressed, only a "Dong" will play when battery
power is low in chime unit..."
"Regulatory Information: This device (WB-94A-TX or WB-97-TX/TR-6505-RX)
complies with Part 15 of the FCC Rules and RSS-210 of Industry Canada..."
"If you experience a problem, follow the guide. You may also want to visit
our Web site at www.desatech.com...."
>If it's on 433.925Mhz, so are weather station remote sensors, which
>will cause some interesting interference, especially since both use
>OOK (on-off keying) for data.
Interesting, but I haven't heard about any weather stations being
constructed around here lately.
>If your unspecified model doorbell has a user programmable security
>code, you might try changing it.
>>I have some neighbors about 80 feet away
>>who have an electronic garage door opener, but there's a wooded area
>>between us and I don't think this could be causing it because it hasn't
>>happened until now.
>Walk 80.0ft and talk to the neighbors. Have them bring their garage
>door opener remote over to your house. Do some testing.
>>The main unit inside uses 4 "C" batteries, then the
>>actual doorbells (one on the front that has a two-tone ring;
>Have you tested the batteries? If you don't have a tester or DVM to
>measure them, just replace them and see if it fixes the problem.
No, unfortunately I don't have a battery tester. I don't mind replacing
them but I thought I'd get some input about other possible problems first.
>>one on the
>>back that has a single ring) use some kind of weird tiny batteries.
>Button cell batteries? They do have a part number.
No, if I recall correctly they don't resemble a button, they're like a
really tiny "AA" battery. I'd probably have to buy them at Radio Shack.
>>It's
>>the single ring doorbell that's been acting up, so maybe that's where the
>>actual problem is.
>Do you have two receivers, one for single ring, and one for the
>unspecified other ring?
No, it's the same receiver, you differentiate between the two-tone and
single tone by placing small plastic "jumpers" in different locations.
>>I'm wondering if wireless doorbells are like smoke detectors, in that
>>they'll start ringing out of the blue when their batteries start to go low.
>No. They tend to go comatose when the battery goes low. Range
>decreases dramatically so it's unlikely that your neighbor is causing
>more problems now. If this has been going on for several days, it's
>unlikely to be a dying battery because it would have totally quit by
>now with all the ringing.
Okay, this is good to know.
>>The batteries have been in the main unit for about two years now, also
>>about the same for the actual doorbells.
>Well, if the C batteries were originally new and good quality alkaline
>cells, they should not be dead in 2 years unless you use the doorbell
>excessively. My guess(tm) would be 1 to 5 years with good batteries,
>and maybe a year or two with junk batteries. Get out the DVM and
>measure the battery voltage for a clue. Anything under about 1.1VDC
>is a near dead alkaline battery.
They're pretty decent batteries, Duracell copper tops with a Mar 2014 date
on them.
I'm also going to follow "Bill"'s suggestion and inspect the back push
button unit; I live close to a heavily wooded area and I'm constantly
battling spiders and other insects outside the house.
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Posted by Stormin Mormon on October 13, 2009, 10:05 pm
I've seen that kind of thing. It may very well be a 12
(twelve) volt battery. Those are used in doorbell remotes,
and I can't remember why. Probably to suck more money out of
your pocket.
--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.
No, if I recall correctly they don't resemble a button,
they're like a
really tiny "AA" battery. I'd probably have to buy them at
Radio Shack.
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Posted by Jeff Liebermann on October 13, 2009, 10:25 pm
On Tue, 13 Oct 2009 20:19:29 -0500, dennism3@dennism3.invalid (Dennis
M) wrote:
>>Any particular maker and model number? Actually, what I would like is
>>the FCC ID number from either the remote or the receiver so I can
>>lookup the frequency. It's usually 418MHz(EU), 433.925Mhz, 315MHz,
>>320MHz, 335MHz, 350MHz, 2400Mhz, etc. The frequency might also be
>>inscribed on the device somewhere.
>It is a Heath/Zenith Wireless Mechanical Battery Operated Chime,
>manufactured by Desa Specialty Products of Bowling Green, Ky.
>On the back the only thing that looks like a model number is "TR-6505-RX."
>For some reason it also says "Canada: 3984 104 559A."
Canada has the CRTC equivalent of the US FCC.
<http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/statutes-lois.htm>
Manual online:
<www.trineonline.com/interior/support/235%20inst%208-14.pdf>
Looks like you have 7 jumpers to program the code. Try a different
combination in both the receiver and the remote (just in case someone
else has a similar model). Incidentally, one manufacturer of garage
door openers ships their units defaulted to the code used for
production testing. Buyers are not in the habit of changing the code,
so code duplications were epidemic. If you called the dealer, the
first thing they would suggest is "change the code".
>But luckily I kept the manual. Some relevant excerpts:
>"In typical use, aklaline batteries will last up to 2 1/2 years"
That should be a clue. Are you a "typical" user?
>"Troubleshooting: Low battery indicator: When the push button designated
>for the "Ding-Dong" tone is pressed, only a "Dong" will play when battery
>power is low in chime unit..."
Nice. There's your built in battery tester.
>"Regulatory Information: This device (WB-94A-TX or WB-97-TX/TR-6505-RX)
>complies with Part 15 of the FCC Rules and RSS-210 of Industry Canada..."
Not exactly legal. The serial number tags are suppose to show the FCC
ID number. I tried various combinations of model number and company
names on the FCC ID site and couldn't find anything. I'm too lazy to
dig under the hundreds of Heath and Zenith products.
>"If you experience a problem, follow the guide. You may also want to visit
>our Web site at www.desatech.com...."
Useless. Their manual search forwards to a Google web search.
>>If it's on 433.925Mhz, so are weather station remote sensors, which
>>will cause some interesting interference, especially since both use
>>OOK (on-off keying) for data.
>Interesting, but I haven't heard about any weather stations being
>constructed around here lately.
It's not just weather stations. It's any kind or thermometer that
uses wireless for communications. Most of them are on 433.925Mhz.
Also remotes for air conditioners, room lighting, door locks, vehicle
alarms, vehicle keys, SCADA systems, and mess of other gadgets that
involve key fobs and very low speed/thruput wireless data. Just enter
"433.925" into a Google search for some hints.
>No, unfortunately I don't have a battery tester. I don't mind replacing
>them but I thought I'd get some input about other possible problems first.
Well, the built in battery tester (one ding instead of two) should be
sufficient to test the batteries. DVM's (digital volt meter) start at
about $5 and are quite handy.
>>Button cell batteries? They do have a part number.
>No, if I recall correctly they don't resemble a button, they're like a
>really tiny "AA" battery. I'd probably have to buy them at Radio Shack.
A-23 12V "alarm" battery. Something like this:
<http://www.batteryprice.com/sizea2312vbattery.aspx>
and available at any hardware store. However, the remote is probably
not the problem as a dead battery would result in no operation. There
is one really remote possibility that I've never actually seen. Water
condenses inside the remote and causes it to falsely activate. Remove
the doorbell and see if it's wet inside.
>>>It's
>>>the single ring doorbell that's been acting up, so maybe that's where the
>>>actual problem is.
>>Do you have two receivers, one for single ring, and one for the
>>unspecified other ring?
>No, it's the same receiver, you differentiate between the two-tone and
>single tone by placing small plastic "jumpers" in different locations.
I have no idea why it would fail to ring once, but ring correctly
twice, unless the distance or power output between the two doorbell
remotes is radically different. A slightly dead battery on the
receiver would cause the one that's furthest away to possibly fail.
However, I can't tell from your description what you mean by "acting
up". If it falses with two rings instead of one, it's probably just
coincidence controlled by whatever is falsing the receiver.
>They're pretty decent batteries, Duracell copper tops with a Mar 2014 date
>on them.
I'm not a big fan of Duracell batteries. See:
<http://www.powerstream.com/AA-tests.htm>
Note the Duracell Coppertop (DC) discharge curve and capacity are far
from the best (for AA cells). I've seen similar lack of capacity
problems using a West Mountain Radio CBA-II battery tester:
<http://www.westmountainradio.com/CBA.htm>
Current favorites (for AA) are cheapo Kirkland cells found at Costco.
However, they don't sell these in C size.
>I'm also going to follow "Bill"'s suggestion and inspect the back push
>button unit; I live close to a heavily wooded area and I'm constantly
>battling spiders and other insects outside the house.
Good idea. I'm betting on water instead of spiders or bugs. Alcohol
does a good job of dissolving bug goo and displacing the water. While
your at it, change the code anyway.
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
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Posted by Bob M. on October 13, 2009, 11:32 pm
> It's not just weather stations. It's any kind or thermometer that
> uses wireless for communications. Most of them are on 433.925Mhz.
> Also remotes for air conditioners, room lighting, door locks, vehicle
> alarms, vehicle keys, SCADA systems, and mess of other gadgets that
> involve key fobs and very low speed/thruput wireless data. Just enter
> "433.925" into a Google search for some hints.
Also add "ham radio" to that list. 420-450 mHz is a popular ham radio band.
The same 420-450 mHz band is where the US Air Force's "Pave PAWS" radars
operate; they have a range of over 3,000 miles. Located at Otis AFB, MA,
Beale AFB, CA and Clear AFS, AK, these radar beams extend out over the
ocean, primarily.
And, does the OP's house have metal siding? Metal siding greatly reduces
the penetration of the transmitter signal to the inside the house. I had
steel siding at the old place & this one; the old place had wireless
doorbells that didn't always work, even with new batteries. This place has
wired doorbells that always work.
The OP's remedy is to install wired doorbells.
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